Advice please - first time trying to buy on C24, got ghosted

[Rori]

Originally Posted by mquarter

I opened a chat with a dealer for a NOS Rolex. They ghosted me after I sent this rather lengthy request for additional photos.

--
a. The dial - set time to 8.45, GMT hand to the 4 position (= 8 position on the GMT bezel), set date to 17th
b. Close up of each of the 4 lugs
c. Crystal & bezel at an angle with light's reflection (want to see if there are any scratches)
d. Case side (both sides) & crown
e. Case back
f. Bracelet clasp
g. Photo of the bracelet open
h. Photo of watch, box and papers together
i. Open the paper and take a photo
j. Remove the bracelet, take photo of the serial number (must match papers)
k. Open the case back to show the movement
--

I admit the list is pretty long and it looks like a lot of work. However, the theme of the advice I read online was to be as thorough as possible. The listing already had some of the photos I requested, but my concern was they weren't high res - ie you couldn't see the tiny uni-directional lines of the brushing on the case. So even though the watch is still stickered, I can't see if there's any scratches etc. Perhaps I've asked for too much too soon.

Anyway I was looking for advice:
1) How do you guys typically engage with the dealer? (getting all your detailed questions answered without them putting you in the the "too hard" basket)

2) Does the type of questions you ask differ depending on whether it's been worn vs never worn/NOS? (In a different interaction, a seller basically shouted at me for asking whether the NOS he was selling had any blemishes or scratches.)

3) And what's the best way for me to salvage this interaction? the dealer's profile seems solid, they were responsive before I sent the above and they really want the piece.

You’re in your right to ask for all those pictures. With today all the super fakes and horrible stories we read daily.
That been said, I would skip all the paranoia and worries altogether and stick to buy new from AD.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Overwound]

In one way you may have found someone that doesn't have the watch and can't comply with your first request. It's possible but not certain. So, maybe good or he's just not willing to comply to your list.

Requests "b" through "i" are completely reasonable and many trusted sellers provide this as standard practice.

Once you get to "j" and "k" you're going to loose a lot of seller's attention. Taking the chance of scratching the bracelet or lug to show the serial number between the lugs isn't something unheard of but not routine. Asking a reseller to open a NOS watch is another above and beyond type of requests. This risks damage to the gasket, threading or foreign particulates getting into the movement if the seller doesn't have all the correct tools and knowledge. While it's not a difficult task trusting anyone to do this could lead to some bad results.

If you stick with your points "b" through ''i", and be sure to purchase from a respectable seller who gives an inspection/return period, you can confirm the other points hands on or use a local Rolex certified watchmaker nearby to verify for you.

Good luck! I have to say, it's better to be extra cautious as you've been rather than purchase quickly and discover trouble down the road.

[fsprow]

If I was the seller, I would have been pretty convinced you would find a little scratch somewhere from handling and would want to return the watch. When I buy a watch, even from an AD, I expect some very slight handling marks - no problem since I will have more the first wearing. Your values are yours and may differ, but I can well understand a seller that chooses not to deal with them.

[m j b]

Originally Posted by mquarter

They ghosted me after I sent this rather lengthy request for additional photos.

I concur with everyone else that said that you asked too much.

Originally Posted by DG123

I sell items on ebay and my policy is to block any potential buyers who ask too many questions.

I don't block anyone, but I've noticed that the people who ask all the questions never win the auction, if they even bother to bid.

Originally Posted by Aquaholic_user

For non trusted members. I cant see why removing the caseback would be too much of a job.

Because a) you run the risk of scratching it and b) technically you need to replace the gasket and have the watch pressure tested.

Originally Posted by Rori

That been said, I would skip all the paranoia and worries altogether and stick to buy new from AD.

This, for you, OP. That's the only way you'll be happy and secure.

[BogdanS]

Originally Posted by Crazy Lugs

I think the simple answer is to be reasonable. I’d ghost you myself if I received the same request, which seems a bit much IMHO.

Agree.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Zoomerang]

I'd probably have entertained most of your requests except i,j,k.

I wouldn't risk damaging the watch to remove the bracelet and caseback and certainly I wouldn't share the s/n.

[Tavli3]

For me the open the caseback on a NOS watch request was an instant break the glass and firmly depress the ejection button. When we get Opus Magnus type emails with a 100 questions we ignore since it is too timely to respond to and they never fail to be problematic customers with never ending phone calls and emails.
Sometimes the best sales are the ones you didn't get.

I would try to call the dealer if you can get their info and have a reasonable talk with them if you really want the watch. You may be able to convince him you're not going to be a never ending problem and he can assuage your concerns of getting scammed.

[CKizzy]

There is always another buyer and there is always another watch...Ghosting this thread now!

[yoast]

In my experience, The more questions people have, the less likely they are to buy.
If they do buy, they will find something wrong or return the item.

Seems you are in hk, probably the only place in the world where pretty much any watch ever made can be found. Just source whatever you are looking for locally.

[upsidedownbelt]

I agree that buying luxury items on the Internet is not a fit for you.

[bondtoys]

I don‘t know any seller of a NOS who is willing to open this .

[Fleetlord]

Originally Posted by mquarter

It's fair enough that people suggest that I keep my requests reasonable, but as I haven't done this before I don't have a frame of reference as to what's "reasonable". Initially I thought the list of requested photos which comprehensively cover the whole watch would be reasonable considering the price of the watch is $20k. If that's not reasonable then what is?

So far there's a lot of feedback saying not to do it the way I did, but could someone give an example of how they've previously handled it with a dealer? E.g. do you:

1) ask a lot of questions, but space them out so it's not too much at once (but then your pre-purchase conversation ends up spanning multiple days)
2) ask fewer questions, and bank more on your judgement of the seller's feedback rating on C24 + other customer feedback you've managed to find outside the platform
3) maybe some kind of middle ground where you only ask the "most important questions" - what are they for you?
4) some other approach?

1-3. No

4. Yes. Buy in person from AD.

[GST15]

Originally Posted by Rori

You’re in your right to ask for all those pictures. With today all the super fakes and horrible stories we read daily.
That been said, I would skip all the paranoia and worries altogether and stick to buy new from AD.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Agree

[Bruno Datejust]

Originally Posted by faimag

Yeah, for a NOS, particularly these 2 would be a no-go:

j. Remove the bracelet, take photo of the serial number (must match papers)
k. Open the case back to show the movement

I totally agree. I'm not a trader but consider these requests unreasonable. For what concerns the photos you want, it depends on the good-will / need to sell of the trader.

[Jpccarguy]

Originally Posted by Tavli3

For me the open the caseback on a NOS watch request was an instant break the glass and firmly depress the ejection button.

[Rowlf]

Anytime someone starts asking me to “set the time” and “change the date” it’s a no-go.

Ask yourself before sending an inquiry: “is this a reasonable request?”

And then ask yourself: “would I be willing to accommodate it?”

[waynorth]

If you sound like a Karen, then I would not be "sharin" or selling my watch to you.

[drrd]

Originally Posted by mquarter

a. The dial - set time to 8.45, GMT hand to the 4 position (= 8 position on the GMT bezel), set date to 17th
b. Close up of each of the 4 lugs
c. Crystal & bezel at an angle with light's reflection (want to see if there are any scratches)
d. Case side (both sides) & crown
e. Case back
f. Bracelet clasp
g. Photo of the bracelet open
h. Photo of watch, box and papers together
i. Open the paper and take a photo
j. Remove the bracelet, take photo of the serial number (must match papers)
k. Open the case back to show the movement

That is pretty funny and no surprise the seller blanked you.

For anything current I wouldn't buy anywhere except an AD.

For vintage and 'NOS' I'd say find a seller with a proven track record, just go with their description and photos, buy on CC and if it looks correct on arival then put the watch into your nearest RSC for a service quote. You don't have to go ahead with the service but for a smallish fee they will assess the watch and will certainly flag up anything fishy about it - far better than you could by looking at a picture of an open case.

[AF_Rob]

Your list makes you seem high maintenance and impossible to please.

I would have at least responded to your message and engaged with you. If I didn’t want to do business with you, I would tell you.

I’ve waived off from a seller here when I realized he would only read the first line of any message and no showed a meeting. He obviously didn’t give a shit.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Nairn1980]

Originally Posted by mquarter

I opened a chat with a dealer for a NOS Rolex. They ghosted me after I sent this rather lengthy request for additional photos.

--
a. The dial - set time to 8.45, GMT hand to the 4 position (= 8 position on the GMT bezel), set date to 17th
b. Close up of each of the 4 lugs
c. Crystal & bezel at an angle with light's reflection (want to see if there are any scratches)
d. Case side (both sides) & crown
e. Case back
f. Bracelet clasp
g. Photo of the bracelet open
h. Photo of watch, box and papers together
i. Open the paper and take a photo
j. Remove the bracelet, take photo of the serial number (must match papers)
k. Open the case back to show the movement
--

I admit the list is pretty long and it looks like a lot of work. However, the theme of the advice I read online was to be as thorough as possible. The listing already had some of the photos I requested, but my concern was they weren't high res - ie you couldn't see the tiny uni-directional lines of the brushing on the case. So even though the watch is still stickered, I can't see if there's any scratches etc. Perhaps I've asked for too much too soon.

Anyway I was looking for advice:
1) How do you guys typically engage with the dealer? (getting all your detailed questions answered without them putting you in the the "too hard" basket)

2) Does the type of questions you ask differ depending on whether it's been worn vs never worn/NOS? (In a different interaction, a seller basically shouted at me for asking whether the NOS he was selling had any blemishes or scratches.)

3) And what's the best way for me to salvage this interaction? the dealer's profile seems solid, they were responsive before I sent the above and they really want the piece.

The seller may be thinking “if this is what he’s like at the enquiry stage, he will be a nightmare after the sale too”

Not saying that’s true or false, but the seller might just be thinking “NEXT” and waiting on the next customer

[77T]

Originally Posted by mquarter

It's fair enough that people suggest that I keep my requests reasonable, but as I haven't done this before I don't have a frame of reference as to what's "reasonable". Initially I thought the list of requested photos which comprehensively cover the whole watch would be reasonable considering the price of the watch is $20k. If that's not reasonable then what is?

So far there's a lot of feedback saying not to do it the way I did, but could someone give an example of how they've previously handled it with a dealer? E.g. do you:

1) ask a lot of questions, but space them out so it's not too much at once (but then your pre-purchase conversation ends up spanning multiple days)
2) ask fewer questions, and bank more on your judgement of the seller's feedback rating on C24 + other customer feedback you've managed to find outside the platform
3) maybe some kind of middle ground where you only ask the "most important questions" - what are they for you?
4) some other approach?

I’ve asked less questions for a $75K watch. Why? Because I only buy from long-term trusted sellers with a lengthy history of standing behind their offering.

But to answer your query, I categorize my information needs in hierarchy.

1) Showstoppers: issues that would cause me to walk away no matter what the other answers might be.
2) Conditional: issues that would make me expect a lower final price.
3) Procedural: issues that can be worked out after 1 & 2 are cleared up.

I don’t flood the seller with questions. No more than 1 or 2 per communique.

So in your case, I would’ve started with visible proof that the watch is in hand and a list of references.

The last queries are things like payment methods and shipping.

In between you might ask for enough info that the seller would still consider you a viable buyer and not a mettlesome tire kicker.

Just my 2¢


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

[mpct5011]

Your 1st request is way over the top. I’d reply to you, but you wouldn’t like my response. You sound like the type of person who will get the watch, immediately complain about it stating you’re returning it, but still wear it for a few days.

[GMT Aviator]

OP, I don’t think you’re confident enough to make this purchase online. No disrespect intended at all but basically, yes, your list is unreasonable and as a seller I’d probably ghost you and move on.
This isn’t the type of business any sellers have got time for. It comes across more as an accusation that says ‘it looks like you’re selling a fake unless you prove all these requests to me’.
You need to do your due diligence by checking more than the watch. Check out the seller. What’s the sellers history and do they have good feedback? What other types of watches are they selling and how long have they been in business? It’s that sort of thing you need to be checking.
If all that checks out then buy the watch. If there’s a problem after that and you know they’re a good seller then you should be taken care of anyway.
That’s how you should go about it. If you can’t do that, you’re best course of action is to only buy from an AD in person.

[porschejeff]

Originally Posted by Crazy Lugs

I think the simple answer is to be reasonable. I’d ghost you myself if I received the same request, which seems a bit much IMHO.

Ditto. A bit excessive (over excessive), why deal with that if there are other interested prospects.

[s14roller]

What watch?

[Moondoggy]

Opening the case back is an absolute no no unless essential works required imo.
Crazy list.

[donas]

I'm not saying you're wrong in your request, as it's a big purchase, but if I was the seller, you sound too needy and are a potential headache down the road. I wouldn't ghost you, but I'd respectfully decline further dealings.

.....to clarify, I'm not saying you are these things, you asked for opinions / interpretations.

[wisguy]

Overkill.

No offense but I would not sell you a watch, you're very likely to be unsatisfied and become a problem down the road.

Buy at an AD a new watch, just don't expect them to open the watch to show you the movement...

[Caramba]

Originally Posted by Harry-57

I sell things on line. Not watches.

I deal with enquiries and what I regard as reasonable questions promptly and politely. When I get an enquiry with a long list of questions, experience has taught me that they tend to follow up with more questions and ultimately don't buy. If I get such enquiries I ignore them. It is possible that I am binning some genuine potential sales, but it's not worth my time. My feedback, ratings and guarantees should be enough. If someone doesn't trust me they should buy from someone else.

Amen to this answer.

[shaunylw]

I probably wouldn't even respond to your request. Setting the positions on the watch before you pay, that's sort of reasonable. Outside of that, I would have no interest as a seller. A laundry list of questions like that would lead me to believe you are going to be a pain to deal with.