My experience at a Breitling boutique

[Archetype]

Originally Posted by Dave O

Sorry, but I tend to be more in the jedione65 camp. I am a true watch enthusiast. I buy what I love, and worry none about resale value. I could care less if the value of the watch dropped to zero the moment I walk out the AD store. The second I walked out of the AD with my Navitimer (at full retail) I knew the value of the watch was going to drop significantly. I didn't care. The watch puts a smile on my face every time it goes on my wrist, and is one of my favorites over some of the Rolex's I own even though they have gone up in value. And to me, this is what matters most - the smile on my face.

With regards to watches being investment pieces. I have fared much better in the stock market over the past 10 years vs what I could have made doing watch investments.

First of all, its a beautiful piece! Good choice.

You are making an emotional argument rather than a rational one. Caring about the monetary value of a luxury timepiece doesn't necessarily entail that you do not care about watches and your only goal is to buy them in order to make money in the future. I find your premise untenable if not illogical.

In the real world where we need be responsible, especially if we have family and kids, monetary value of things we purchase MATTERS unless you are very wealthy and 5-10k mean nothing to you.

How worrying about resale value is related to not being a watch enthusiast? I just do not understand how you connect the two.

If you were to say that I want to support the brands I love and I don't care about losing money then this is another matter altogether but so many people seem to conflate two completely different things.

I am not a flipper, I just like to preserve money if possible (if its a meaningful amount) since money doesn't grow on trees. You do this yourself, am sure, with other things in your life but for some reason when it comes to watches you act like a religious zealot.

You can be a true watch enthusiast and care about value preservation as I am, what I am not is irresponsible with money because am not a millionaire and I repeat money doesn't grow on trees.

[Dave O]

Originally Posted by Archetype

First of all, its a beautiful piece! Good choice.

Thanks, and I agree.

Originally Posted by Archetype

You are making an emotional argument rather than a rational one. Caring about the monetary value of a luxury timepiece doesn't necessarily entail that you do not care about watches and your only goal is to buy them in order to make money in the future. I find your premise untenable if not illogical.

In the real world where we need be responsible, especially if we have family and kids, monetary value of things we purchase MATTERS unless you are very wealthy and 5-10k mean nothing to you.

We are polar opposites on these points. I treat my watches no different than buying a new car or going on a nice vacation. When I buy a new car I give no thought to what the resale value might be down the road. I buy a car that excites me, a car that I would love to drive. I would never buy a car over another car just because of resale value. I will buy the car that puts the biggest smile on my face each and every time I drive it, no different than a watch. Same goes for a vacation. The dollar value of a vacation is zero once it is over. Does that mean I won't take a vacation because there is no value to it once it is over? No, I take vacations for the memories and the smiles it puts on my face. Again, no different than a watch. I'm not being irresponsible. We are only on this planet for a finite amount of time. I want to enjoy my life while I have that time.

Originally Posted by Archetype

How worrying about resale value is related to not being a watch enthusiast? I just do not understand how you connect the two.

In your first post you said you didn't buy anything because "I had NO desire to buy anything from them only to walk out and lose 30% of its value." And "...resale value is very important to me as I may one day need to sell it." To me, if you loved a watch you would buy it just as I did as stated in my post knowing full well it would drop in value the moment I walked out the door. But that just may be me, and I can understand your point. But my level of enthusiast I believe is on a different level than yours as I never plan on selling any of my watches.

Originally Posted by Archetype

If you were to say that I want to support the brands I love and I don't care about losing money then this is another matter altogether but so many people seem to conflate two completely different things.

It has nothing to do with supporting brands that I love, it's about purchasing watches that I love. Some of my watches others would never buy. And that's ok. But I could care less if the value of a watch I buy drops to zero the moment I walk out of the AD. I buy it because I love it, just as I go on vacations with zero return on investment.

Originally Posted by Archetype

I am not a flipper, I just like to preserve money if possible (if its a meaningful amount) since money doesn't grow on trees. You do this yourself, am sure, with other things in your life but for some reason when it comes to watches you act like a religious zealot.

You can be a true watch enthusiast and care about value preservation as I am, what I am not is irresponsible with money because am not a millionaire and I repeat money doesn't grow on trees.

I understand wanting to preserve your money. I just don't treat watches like assets, which it seems you do. I treat them like a vacation or car that depreciates in value. I live my life the same way I live my watch life, so not a religious zealot when it comes to watches. We only live once, so enjoy the moment.

[Archetype]

Originally Posted by Dave O

The dollar value of a vacation is zero once it is over. Does that mean I won't take a vacation because there is no value to it once it is over? No, I take vacations for the memories and the smiles it puts on my face. Again, no different than a watch.

You are missing my point entirely. The two are very different and you don't compare apples to apples. Again you sound irresponsible when it comes to money as you do not seem to care about wasting it when you can avoid doing so.

Spending 10k for holidays and spending 10k for a Rolex is NOT the same. Both give you pleasure and satisfaction with the big difference being that with the Rolex your 10k will always be there should for instance an urgent medical attention at a private hospital is needed. Your holidays would have left you with nothing tangible to rely on at a future date. I am not saying one is better than the other nor am I saying we need to always think about value retainment but taking a vacation is not the same as buying a watch from a financial point of view.

My point is IF one can avoid wasting money one should do so. It doesn't matter what it is that you are buying and why you are buying it. I think you misunderstand me completely.

Think of this analogy and compare it to buying a watch from a boutique vs grey market.

If you had in front of you on two different reputable websites two holiday packages both offering exactly the same but one was 40% less costly(due to a promotional event). In addition to this if you picked the cheaper one you would also get refunded 80% of your funds at the end of your trip. Which one would you choose? You come across as someone who wouldn't care which one he picked. I suspect you are very wealthy hence money is not a consideration for you which would explain your stance on this.

Originally Posted by Dave O

But my level of enthusiast I believe is on a different level than yours as I never plan on selling any of my watches.

"I don't plan" and "I will not sell no matter what" are two completely different things though. If something unfortunate happened and you needed money you didn't have you would sell them and you know this. I have watches I just get bored of after some years and never wear them so I sell them OR something happens and I need access to funds so I sell them. These are the only reasons I'd ever sell a watch. Generally speaking so long I like a watch I would almost never sell it. Its nice to build a collection over time. Each watch has different meaning and memory associated to it.

Originally Posted by Dave O

I understand wanting to preserve your money. I just don't treat watches like assets, which it seems you do. I treat them like a vacation or car that depreciates in value.

I will reiterate it once more. Caring about the value of a watch doesn't make one less or more "true watch collector". If it does you haven't demonstrated it yet. What you have demonstrated is that you don't care about wasting money when there is an easy and readily available alternative not to which is fair enough. You don't need treat it as an asset to be prudent about where you are buying them from. Bar wealthy people I always feel sorry for normal folk who walk into boutiques and get ripped given the availability of alternatives.

[Archetype]

Originally Posted by Dave O

To me, if you loved a watch you would buy it just as I did as stated in my post knowing full well it would drop in value the moment I walked out the door. But that just may be me, and I can understand your point. But my level of enthusiast I believe is on a different level than yours as I never plan on selling any of my watches.

Yes I would buy it, but not from the boutique if am going to lose a shit ton of money just by walking out when I can easily buy it from elsewhere. This doesn't make me any less enthusiastic about watches. If I can minimize my loss I will if I can't (like with buying clothes) then I'd be happy to take the hit.
Selling or never selling it doesn't make a difference. Someone offers you something for 5 and someone else for 10 and you go for the one that offers it to you for 10. Everything else being equal you must be in a real minority to not care about getting a good deal.

[Dave O]

Originally Posted by Archetype

You are missing my point entirely. The two are very different and you don't compare apples to apples. Again you sound irresponsible when it comes to money as you do not seem to care about wasting it when you can avoid doing so.

Spending 10k for holidays and spending 10k for a Rolex is NOT the same. Both give you pleasure and satisfaction with the big difference being that with the Rolex your 10k will always be there should for instance an urgent medical attention at a private hospital is needed. Your holidays would have left you with nothing tangible to rely on at a future date. I am not saying one is better than the other nor am I saying we need to always think about value retainment but taking a vacation is not the same as buying a watch from a financial point of view.

This is where we differ. I do treat them the same. There is no difference in my mind. When I buy a watch I consider it money gone. I would NEVER spend money on a watch or a vacation if I didn't have a fund set aside for emergency purposes. My parents instilled that into me. Because of this fund, I would never have to sell a watch for emergency purposes. If you would have to sell a watch to fund an emergency you may be spending beyond your means. Since I don't know you, I don't know if this is true or not.

Originally Posted by Archetype

My point is IF one can avoid wasting money one should do so. It doesn't matter what it is that you are buying and why you are buying it. I think you misunderstand me completely.

Think of this analogy and compare it to buying a watch from a boutique vs grey market.

If you had in front of you on two different reputable websites two holiday packages both offering exactly the same but one was 40% less costly(due to a promotional event). In addition to this if you picked the cheaper one you would also get refunded 80% of your funds at the end of your trip. Which one would you choose? You come across as someone who wouldn't care which one he picked. I suspect you are very wealthy hence money is not a consideration for you which would explain your stance on this.

It all depends. Am I against wasting money? Of course I am. However, the cheapest price doesn't always represent the best value. With one exception, I always buy from my AD(s). I have built a strong relationship with them which in turn I get allocated watches that others don't. And the cheapest price doesn't always mean the best service. Some of those bargain prices for vacations are bargains for a reason. I've worked my entire life to build up the nest egg that I have. I'm at the point in my life that I care more about value than whatever is the cheapest price around. As the saying goes, you get what you pay for.

Originally Posted by Archetype

"I don't plan" and "I will not sell no matter what" are two completely different things though. If something unfortunate happened and you needed money you didn't have you would sell them and you know this. I have watches I just get bored of after some years and never wear them so I sell them OR something happens and I need access to funds so I sell them. These are the only reasons I'd ever sell a watch. Generally speaking so long I like a watch I would almost never sell it. Its nice to build a collection over time. Each watch has different meaning and memory associated to it.

I will reiterate it once more. Caring about the value of a watch doesn't make one less or more "true watch collector". If it does you haven't demonstrated it yet. What you have demonstrated is that you don't care about wasting money when there is an easy and readily available alternative not to which is fair enough. You don't need treat it as an asset to be prudent about where you are buying them from. Bar wealthy people I always feel sorry for normal folk who walk into boutiques and get ripped given the availability of alternatives.

Again, there is a lot more to a purchase than price alone. My relationships with my AD's have gotten me things that others simply can't get. I don't think you understand this at all. And again, I don't see watches as assets, but rather beautiful instruments in a hobby I love.

Originally Posted by Archetype

Yes I would buy it, but not from the boutique if am going to lose a shit ton of money just by walking out when I can easily buy it from elsewhere. This doesn't make me any less enthusiastic about watches. If I can minimize my loss I will if I can't (like with buying clothes) then I'd be happy to take the hit.
Selling or never selling it doesn't make a difference. Someone offers you something for 5 and someone else for 10 and you go for the one that offers it to you for 10. Everything else being equal you must be in a real minority to not care about getting a good deal.

Again, as I have stated above, there is more to consider at times than just the cheapest price. Do I care about price? Yes, but it's not the only thing I consider when purchasing something. For example, when I buy something on Amazon I buy the seller, not the cheapest price. If I have to return something I want a smooth transaction. You hear that a lot when buying watches on this forum. That is, buy the seller, not the watch.

In the end, I think we just agree to disagree. Neither is wrong, we are just different.