Sports steel allocations to ADs

[MovieGuy]

I worked at a US AD for almost 20 years from 1998 to 2017. I was the Rolex specialist.
Obviously things have changed in the Rolex world since then but here's what happend at the store where I worked:

Our Rolex rep would come in quarterly, take an inventory of in-stock watches and make suggestions on what to order. We'd place an order for about 25 watches. They'd usually show up 3-5 at a time over the next month. There were different models that we were required to either have in the case or on order for stock. Pretty much all steel Professional watches were in this group along with at least 3 steel and gold Professional models. At least 4 all precious metal models.

We would get about 1 steel Daytona per month, random dial color. We could order as many other Daytonas as we wanted and get them right away.

Other than Daytonas, we could get pretty much as many steel professional watches as we ordered, usually within a month. I remember when I first started working at the store a guy came in and wanted to get 5 steel Submariners for himself, his Dad and his brothers who all ran a business together. We had two in store and were able to get the other three within a couple weeks. Granted, this would have been in the late 90s.

If you have any other questions for me in thsi regard, feel free to ask.

[Jack T]

If, as was stated above, there are 1,400 AD’s world wide, with an average of 2 stores per AD, all sheer conjecture on my part.

Then we have an average of 3 sales associates per store, each seeing 10 customers a week.

Assuming each store operates 48 weeks per year, that means there are 4,032,000 different stories one might hear about how Rolex allocates watches to its retailers.

[Torshalla]

I guess the number of stainless steel sports models that are made / sent to ADs is carefully calculated to secure continued rarity…


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[gerry100]

Originally Posted by gerry100

Assuming 600 watches a year and an average of $5k margin per unit, the AD enjoys $3 million in margin for a product that sells itself.

Understandable that they would protect this product line and not risk their status to support flippers.

Also understand that smart business would be to leverage this for their total business results.

To be fair, Rolex doesnt sell itself as well when economic conditions sour.

Patience

[Calatrava r]

Originally Posted by MovieGuy

I worked at a US AD for almost 20 years from 1998 to 2017. I was the Rolex specialist.
Obviously things have changed in the Rolex world since then but here's what happend at the store where I worked:

Our Rolex rep would come in quarterly, take an inventory of in-stock watches and make suggestions on what to order. We'd place an order for about 25 watches. They'd usually show up 3-5 at a time over the next month. There were different models that we were required to either have in the case or on order for stock. Pretty much all steel Professional watches were in this group along with at least 3 steel and gold Professional models. At least 4 all precious metal models.

We would get about 1 steel Daytona per month, random dial color. We could order as many other Daytonas as we wanted and get them right away.

Other than Daytonas, we could get pretty much as many steel professional watches as we ordered, usually within a month. I remember when I first started working at the store a guy came in and wanted to get 5 steel Submariners for himself, his Dad and his brothers who all ran a business together. We had two in store and were able to get the other three within a couple weeks. Granted, this would have been in the late 90s.

If you have any other questions for me in thsi regard, feel free to ask.

This is what I would think. 100 or more watches a month to an AD sounds unrealistic to me. These watches are currently scarce precisely because not a lot of watches are delivered to ADs relative to the demand. 25 watches a month was a ton to stores years ago when the line was sluggish to sell.

[bluestreak]

Originally Posted by gerry100

To be fair, Rolex doesnt sell itself as well when economic conditions sour.

Patience

Hoping for a global recession so one can get a luxury watch….

People brains are completely addled by not being able to get a watch.

[bluestreak]

Originally Posted by MRBolton

I think that the database topic has been discussed before, and one conclusion was that Rolex didn't want to take on the privacy law exposure by keeping all the customers' data. However, I personally think it makes perfect sense to do so.

Regarding these watch brands shooting themselves in the foot with younger generations, I definitely agree. Many brands had their time in the sun the last 3-6 years, and the chickens are coming home to roost on the grey market now. Look at brands like Vacheron or Czapek. They hit highs you would've never predicted, and things are correcting.

Rolex, AP, and Patek, on the other hand, I think has done so much damage to their brand experience that I think it will be hard to shake off down the road. As Warren Buffett once highlighted, customers often forget things about that they bought, including the price, but they usually don't forget whether the experience was good or not. The majority of people walking into the majority of ADs are not walking out with a good experience right now.

You're not even able to get the most simple entry level models from the brand, and yet you have people who have been able to buy multiples of even the hardest to get models. It is so backwards and an absolute racket being ran that Rolex at this point is complicit in allowing.

Any evidence that this is happening? Other than rantings here, which is a pretty niche community? Or is this just wishful thinking/fantasy of people who aren’t able to get the Rolex you want.

The fact of the matter is, you can get almost any Rolex in a relatively short period of time. As long as it isn’t one of the hottest models.

Most people aren’t getting a bad experience. They are being treated nicely, told that what they want isn’t available, their name gets taken down and they leave. This has happened to me every time. And I eventually got two steel models.

Only to the super entitled is simply being told “we don’t have what you want” is considered bad service.

[sgt10p]

It's good.to read from people in the know and not just speculation.

The fact is you can buy any Rolex if you're willing to pay the market price. Rolex have to be complimented in transfering the warranty with the watch. All you have to decide is how much you're willing to pay?

PM model, less than retail, SS more.

[buffetwarren]

The privacy law thing makes no sense. All the big fashion brands take your info. Lots of huge brands do it. Rolex doesn’t because it prefers to have ADs manage the relationships. It’s a winning business model for them, but maybe in the future they look to getting more into the direct to consumer space.

[kopi-c]

Originally Posted by luk4s83

Yep, the only person who is &*% is the one who actually wants to wear a watch...
It's pretty easy to stop, we just need to stop buying brand new watches from "secondary dealers" or advising other people to do so.

I am with you.

Honestly, it is weird to pay more than MSRP for a Rolex on the secondary market, or another brand watch that is currently still in production. If I cannot get it direct from the AD, so be it and move on or just wait it out until "I get the call."

[luk4s83]

Originally Posted by kopi-c

I am with you.

Honestly, it is weird to pay more than MSRP for a Rolex on the secondary market, or another brand watch that is currently still in production. If I cannot get it direct from the AD, so be it and move on or just wait it out until "I get the call."

To me paying over MSRP for a watch that is currently in production is like paying for sex. Not gonna do that. Also, I will not buy anything I don't want or don't need to "build the relationship". I have my dignity.
I can wait to get a watch from AD. I'm not expecting them to give me the exact date, but I would hope they provide at least a ballpark time. So far they didn't even tell me that I will get a watch I requested anytime at all. I didn't request anything rare, highly sought after or hard to obtain like Pepsi or Daytona. I know people are getting this model within weeks. But local AD's keep feeding me with BS. This is not a nice buying experience by any stretch of imagination, and certainly not premium. I was hoping to get a watch to commemorate significant life event, wear it and enjoy it, but so far I only feel frustrated, ignored and humiliated. If anything this is how you loose customers.

[bluestreak]

Originally Posted by luk4s83

To me paying over MSRP for a watch that is currently in production is like paying for sex. Not gonna do that. Also, I will not buy anything I don't want or don't need to "build the relationship". I have my dignity.
I can wait to get a watch from AD. I'm not expecting them to give me the exact date, but I would hope they provide at least a ballpark time. So far they didn't even tell me that I will get a watch I requested anytime at all. I didn't request anything rare, highly sought after or hard to obtain like Pepsi or Daytona. I know people are getting this model within weeks. But local AD's keep feeding me with BS. This is not a nice buying experience by any stretch of imagination, and certainly not premium. I was hoping to get a watch to commemorate significant life event, wear it and enjoy it, but so far I only feel frustrated, ignored and humiliated. If anything this is how you loose customers.

If you feel “humiliated” because you can’t get a watch, that’s on you, not on Rolex.

[hartsy]

This is a fascinating thread! Lots of good info

[zengineer]

Originally Posted by luk4s83

Yep, the only person who is &*% is the one who actually wants to wear a watch...

It's pretty easy to stop, we just need to stop buying brand new watches from "secondary dealers" or advising other people to do so.

Things find their market value. Day 1: we all hold hands, draw numbers out of a hat for the order we get a watch and agree not to pay over MSRP. Day 2: I want a Daytona now and offer $200 over MSRP...$200 is nothing right and I get it now instead of 2027 when my turn to buy at MSRP comes up. I had my fingers crossed during the ceremony. Day 3 morning: somebody says they'll pay $500 over. Day 3 after lunch: somebody pays $20,000 over because money means nothing to them or they simply can't wait.

[MarioB83]

Feeling humiliated for an old fashioned time machine made of steel is too far for a grown rational man. Reorganize your mind man

[luk4s83]

Yep, humiliated is not the right word. It's just a watch and I couldn't care less. I'm not going to bribe anyone nor I will buy eleven Tudors to "build a history" and get a Rolex. If they'll offer it to me in a reasonable time I'll buy it and certainly it won't be the last one. If not I will just move on. There's a lot to discover in this hobby. It's just disappointing. One way or another, so far dealing with 3 out of 4 Rolex AD's I've tried was probably the worst customer experience I've ever had. Oh well.

[In-N-Out]

Originally Posted by luk4s83

Yep, humiliated is not the right word. It's just a watch and I couldn't care less. I'm not going to bribe anyone nor I will buy eleven Tudors to "build a history" and get a Rolex. If they'll offer it to me in a reasonable time I'll buy it and certainly it won't be the last one. If not I will just move on. There's a lot to discover in this hobby. It's just disappointing. One way or another, so far dealing with 3 out of 4 Rolex AD's I've tried was probably the worst customer experience I've ever had. Oh well.

exactly how I feel. there are other brands to buy. it's not an issue about money, I want to be respected as a client. ive bought one Rolex before the hype, haven't bought one since then bc im not buying pieces I don't want just for a Rolex.

I've moved on to AP and they've treated me much better with far greater transparency.

[James84]

This thread is sounding off alarms for some authorized dealers and even Rolex reading this. Loll.

The truth is every AD gets boxes of watches and sports models regularly.

Bigger doors get more subs, GMT and Daytonas monthly. But ALL doors get them regularly, a long with precious metals, ladies and Datejusts.

The bottom line is they hold or leverage all stainless sports pieces (steel Daytonas, GMT) to push slower moving stock. Rolex even encourages this behavior because they want ALL of their stock sold without discount, PERIOD. That’s the only thing that matters to Rolex.

Your AD is almost certainly lying to you about how much stock they have, where it’s at, how they use it, who gets it etc……

This is a business and bottom line and margins are what matter most to Rolex and it’s AD’s. Both companies leverage the grey market pricing to push more and if possible ALL products. These are the FACTS, plain and simple.

Please also note there are AD’s and Rolex affiliates on this forum monitoring regularly and will comment to throw you off too.

[luk4s83]

Another question is if Rolex cares. I hope they do. If they do you'd think from time to time they would send "undercover" customers to verify how AD operates.
It's also pretty easy to inquire a "secondary market" dealer offering one month old watch for a serial number and track the AD / SA who sold it...

[rjohnston713]

Originally Posted by James84

This thread is sounding off alarms for some authorized dealers and even Rolex reading this. Loll.

The truth is every AD gets boxes of watches and sports models regularly.

Bigger doors get more subs, GMT and Daytonas monthly. But ALL doors get them regularly, a long with precious metals, ladies and Datejusts.

The bottom line is they hold or leverage all stainless sports pieces (steel Daytonas, GMT) to push slower moving stock. Rolex even encourages this behavior because they want ALL of their stock sold without discount, PERIOD. That’s the only thing that matters to Rolex.

Your AD is almost certainly lying to you about how much stock they have, where it’s at, how they use it, who gets it etc……

This is a business and bottom line and margins are what matter most to Rolex and it’s AD’s. Both companies leverage the grey market pricing to push more and if possible ALL products. These are the FACTS, plain and simple.

Please also note there are AD’s and Rolex affiliates on this forum monitoring regularly and will comment to throw you off too.

It's the blatant lying and cat and mouse game that needs to stop. I am in sales and sell a product that is many multiples far more expensive than Rolexes and most watches for that matter. I would never treat any of my clients in the manner at which most get treated. Part of this is on Rolex for refusing to put in place the steps needed to fix the grey market and the other part is you're at the mercy of the honesty, needs, desperation, burnout, or integrity of that particular AD or SA.

Even if there is a long watchlist and realistically things are months out or a year, a good AD or SA would have a proper CRM in place and methods to keep up with their customers and build life long fans especially if they want to sell other items. I pay for jewelry at the ADs that show me customer service that I find similar to how I would treat my clients. I've said it before but most of these places just miss the forest for the trees and don't understand the long game or sales cycles.

The ease of sales the past few years makes a lot of people forget that Rolex has done such a great job of branding that for a lot of people finally owning a Rolex is a sign of great success or once in a lifetime achievement. They want to champion the brand as it has somehow over the course of their life been associated with greatness. These are also not cheap things and can be a ton of money for the majority of people. To finally save or achieve something that you want to commemorate with an iconic piece only to be shunned as a mere commoner or laughed at or felt dismissed is just not a proper way to treat people. I've had positive experiences with most ADs so far, shame to see others haven't. And yes I've been waiting in excess over a year for very simple non SS Sport pieces which can be frustrating.

[Harry-57]

Originally Posted by buffetwarren

The privacy law thing makes no sense. All the big fashion brands take your info. Lots of huge brands do it.

In the UK and EU this is illegal. ADs can and do keep customer details on file, just as any other retail business can do unless the customer refuses to allow it. They are not permitted to share this data. It's bound to be different depending on which country/region you reside and shop.

[Harry-57]

Originally Posted by Torshalla

I guess the number of stainless steel sports models that are made / sent to ADs is carefully calculated to secure continued rarity…

The point is that they are not rare. They are mass produced and people are buying, selling and trading them all over the place. Demand for some models at ADs exceeds supply. That's popularity, not rarity.

[bluestreak]

Originally Posted by Harry-57

The point is that they are not rare. They are mass produced and people are buying, selling and trading them all over the place. Demand for some models at ADs exceeds supply. That's popularity, not rarity.

Rarity is relative. It doesn’t have a definition. Whether something is rare or not is subjective.

Scarcity means supply doesn’t meet demand. Which for certainly applies to many Rolex models.

[kopi-c]

Originally Posted by luk4s83

Yep, humiliated is not the right word. It's just a watch and I couldn't care less. I'm not going to bribe anyone nor I will buy eleven Tudors to "build a history" and get a Rolex. If they'll offer it to me in a reasonable time I'll buy it and certainly it won't be the last one. If not I will just move on. There's a lot to discover in this hobby. It's just disappointing. One way or another, so far dealing with 3 out of 4 Rolex AD's I've tried was probably the worst customer experience I've ever had. Oh well.

I understand what you mean.

Buying a watch from Rolex AD can be disappointing & frustrating at the same time. I own other brands not just Rolex so am content with my collections.

Keep following up with the AD's and hopefully, they can delivery within a reasonable amount of time.

[kopi-c]

Originally Posted by luk4s83

Another question is if Rolex cares. I hope they do. If they do you'd think from time to time they would send "undercover" customers to verify how AD operates.
It's also pretty easy to inquire a "secondary market" dealer offering one month old watch for a serial number and track the AD / SA who sold it...

What I find interesting, is that when a watch is posted up for sale.. the serial number is blurred out or seller does not want to list it. WHY NOT?!

Say buying a car online, the VIN number is usually shown, or can message the seller for the VIN number; so the buyer can run a CarFax report.

I would think if the member who post their watch for sale would list the serial number for full transparency would be a good thing.

[rolesor2022]

Originally Posted by Harry-57

The point is that they are not rare. They are mass produced and people are buying, selling and trading them all over the place. Demand for some models at ADs exceeds supply. That's popularity, not rarity.

The ladies datejust, explorers, subs, etc are not rare. BUT particular models like SS Daytonas, Pepsi are basically rare. Rolex produces ~1m watches a year but out of that number, only ~15,000-~30,000 SS Daytonas are produced a year. That's less than AP ROs

[Hodog16]

Originally Posted by kopi-c

What I find interesting, is that when a watch is posted up for sale.. the serial number is blurred out or seller does not want to list it. WHY NOT?!

Say buying a car online, the VIN number is usually shown, or can message the seller for the VIN number; so the buyer can run a CarFax report.

I would think if the member who post their watch for sale would list the serial number for full transparency would be a good thing.

The serial number is blurred out for two reasons:

1. Any Rolex AD can look up where the watch was purchased based on the S/N, so grey dealers "protect" their sources by blocking the serial number. Also people would be less willing to sell to grey if their AD can easily find out that they flipped.
2. Any counterfeit company can see a serial number and know - okay that serial number is a BLNR, then they can create counterfeit BLNR's with that serial number to make it less easy to detect.

[bluestreak]

Originally Posted by kopi-c

What I find interesting, is that when a watch is posted up for sale.. the serial number is blurred out or seller does not want to list it. WHY NOT?!

Say buying a car online, the VIN number is usually shown, or can message the seller for the VIN number; so the buyer can run a CarFax report.

I would think if the member who post their watch for sale would list the serial number for full transparency would be a good thing.

Why would this info need to be posted. If I’m buying a watch, I’ll ask for the serial number, but for an ad? It’s not necessary.
There isn’t a Carfax equivalent for watches. This would serve no purpose except to let ADs see if their clients tried to sell their watch. This isn’t information a buyer needs. And it’s nobody’s business when or why someone wants to sell their property.

[Harry-57]

Originally Posted by bluestreak

Scarcity means supply doesn’t meet demand. Which for certainly applies to many Rolex models.

The Sky Dweller is an anecdotal case in point. My AD gets one TT Sky Dweller every 12 months or thereabouts, compared to 4-6 SS models. The TT is rare compared to the SS but my AD often has a TT for sale, whereas the lists for the SS models are closed. The same AD gets around twice as many SS blue Sky Dwellers per year than each of the other two SS models. They are queuing around the block for the black and white SS models but they're queuing to the next town for the more plentiful blue model.

[Zach69SS]

I agree with everything said and I’m sick of games too, there is no reason for the BS you should be able to get most models within a reasonable amount of time with the exception.

Especially now that the market is softer. The steering to models you don’t want and the Rolex’s are in strong demand , phrase, please. I was offered a watch and agreed right away and after a few days of back and forth this was a 20K purchase, I was told that the watch could not be sold to me because they are a boutique with many other brands?

So if I don’t buy the others then I can’t have a Rolex. It was not said but implied. I said goodbye to the SA and would never buy anything there even if I was offered a Panda.
I would never treat a customer that way in my business.