Porsche just another BMW Audi Mercedes Volvo, now.

[superdog]

Originally Posted by Chewbacca

I find the 718 is the spiritual successor to the 911. The 911 died about 10-15 years ago. It’s fast but also a bloated GT car more than a nimble snug sports car that wants to kill you.

And a Macan is a Porsche. So whether one feels the ‘specialness’ is still in the 911 and ‘Edition’ models, we’re talking about brand here. Not just 911. The 911 made and was the face of Porsche when it was Porsche.

Ask anyone who knows these cars and not just owns one and you’ll know.

While I appreciate your comment, I cannot disagree more. Out of any Supercar Ive driven, the 911 is by far the best balanced, and most planted. And the 911 is a Supercar for more regular people. Which of course, I get why you dislike it so much. The poors can attain them.

In regard to it not being a nimble sports car…A lot of top tier drivers actually say the 911 is boring because it just too good. The car actually makes the driver better. Which is why I like it so much. I’m a terrible driver. If you’ve ever actually driven one, there is no way you could make that statement.

Especially in comparison to air cooled turbos. Which are nicknamed the widow maker for a reason. You had to be an exceptional driver to keep it under control.

Regarding the brand, yeah I agree. It has lost it status. Hard to disagree with your very pointed statement.

But…I have to ask…if you have such a well thought out and very specific point of view, why the question in the first place? You clearly know the answer.

Oh wait. I forgot who I was taking to.

[Chewbacca]

Originally Posted by superdog

While I appreciate your comment, I cannot disagree more. Out of any Supercar Ive driven, the 911 is by far the best balanced, and most planted. And the 911 is a Supercar for more regular people. Which of course, I get why you dislike it so much. The poors can attain them.

In regard to it not being a nimble sports car…A lot of top tier drivers actually say the 911 is boring because it just too good. The car actually makes the driver better. Which is why I like it so much. I’m a terrible driver. If you’ve ever actually driven one, there is no way you could make that statement.

Especially in comparison to air cooled turbos. Which are nicknamed the widow maker for a reason. You had to be an exceptional driver to keep it under control.

Regarding the brand, yeah I agree. It has lost it status. Hard to disagree with your very pointed statement.

But…I have to ask…if you have such a well thought out and very specific point of view, why the question in the first place? You clearly know the answer.

Oh wait. I forgot who I was taking to.

Proper sporting cars should have flaws and try to kill you. History proves this. I have no desire for modern boulevard fast cars to appease the track day egos of podiatrists or hair stylists with nanny features and ‘too good’ remarks. Give me Sophia Loren throwing a vase at me from across the room over Mrs Cleaver saying meatloaf is ready any day.

[superdog]

Originally Posted by Chewbacca

Proper sporting cars should have flaws and try to kill you. History proves this. I have no desire for proper racing cars to appease the track day egos of podiatrists or hair stylists.

Hard to argue there. And I really would love an air cooled turbo at some point.

I truly look forward to one day glimpsing what it’s like to have real money.

I just heard of a Chicago billionaire who crashed his hyper car at the track. Sadly he died. His family was watching. He’s apparently a big track guy. It was a family event and he went into the wall.

I’m hearing this second hand, so some of my details might be wrong. I think he was Chicago based. Really sad story. But he was in his 70’s and surely lived a wonderful life.

[Chewbacca]

Originally Posted by superdog

Hard to argue there. And I really would love an air cooled turbo at some point.

I truly look forward to one day glimpsing what it’s like to have real money.

I just heard of a Chicago billionaire who crashed his hyper car at the track. Sadly he died. His family was watching. He’s apparently a big track guy. It was a family event and he went into the wall.

I’m hearing this second hand, so some of my details might be wrong. I think he was Chicago based. Really sad story. But he was in his 70’s and surely lived a wonderful life.

Rip.

These cars are faster than 80s and early 90s F1 cars. No business owing racing one without a FIA license for the class. Overconfidence and lack of respect with the ‘safety features’ also plays a part. Physics and walls don’t care.

[SDGT3]

Chewy is on a roll today, but to his point, my 2001 Honda Odyssey had more horsepower than a Corvette from 10 years prior.

[Chiboy]

Originally Posted by SDGT3

Chewy is on a roll today, but to his point, my 2001 Honda Odyssey had more horsepower than a Corvette from 10 years prior.

Is that what they call a “humble brag?”

[SDGT3]

Originally Posted by Chiboy

Is that what they call a “humble brag?”

They see me rollin' in the Odyssey... they hate'in .

[sambb]

honestly bentley and panamera are not much different except bentley is more isolated and luxurious. Both are sporty and fast, and handling is also decent, and neither is like driving a 911. However, the modern 911 is very different from the older 911s, and the 718 is much better for handling.

None of this matters except on a track. At reasonable US highway speeds, most sports cars are largely irrelevant, except for the psychological cachet : of the marque, the ability to know its capabilities, and the ability to know its acceleration and handling - even if rarely used on US roads.

it is fine to buy the 911 for the psychological aspect of knowing its awesome , but it hardly matters on the road except for knowing that you are driving an upper echelon car. Same could probably be said for a patek grand comp, or a fine bottle of overpriced wine, or (in the past) expensive audio/stereo equipmnent.

Remember when people bought McIntosh audio equipment? Now, you listen on an iphone with airpods, and the experience is just as good, if not better. On the other hand, perhaps listening to a cheap stereo with a nice date and a cheap bottle of wine might be better than a 50k stereo. Same goes for cars. Driving with the top down at 35mph in a bentley GTC with a nice date, on the way to a nice dinner is probably preferable than a 911 turbo at 90 mph alone looking for cops while teens are texting and driving in their 5000 lb SUVs and you hope they dont rear end you.

Spend your money as you wish and love it!

[Chewbacca]

Originally Posted by SDGT3

Chewy is on a roll today, but to his point, my 2001 Honda Odyssey had more horsepower than a Corvette from 10 years prior.

Paul!!!!!!! He’s making fun of your Vette!!!!!

[Tricolore66]

I’ve had a couple of 930’s and a bunch of 3.2’s (currently an ‘84 Targa). I love the turbo body but they’re a pain to maintain over a 3.2. Neither are very fast by modern standards, and the sweet spot IMO is the M491 turbo-look 3.2. Basically a turbo body, brakes, and suspension with 3.2 motor. That will probably be my next one.

Originally Posted by superdog

Hard to argue there. And I really would love an air cooled turbo at some point.

I truly look forward to one day glimpsing what it’s like to have real money.

I just heard of a Chicago billionaire who crashed his hyper car at the track. Sadly he died. His family was watching. He’s apparently a big track guy. It was a family event and he went into the wall.

I’m hearing this second hand, so some of my details might be wrong. I think he was Chicago based. Really sad story. But he was in his 70’s and surely lived a wonderful life.

[Dino944]

Originally Posted by Chewbacca

Proper sporting cars should have flaws and try to kill you. History proves this. I have no desire for modern boulevard fast cars to appease the track day egos of podiatrists or hair stylists with nanny features and ‘too good’ remarks. Give me Sophia Loren throwing a vase at me from across the room over Mrs Cleaver saying meatloaf is ready any day.

Amusing and completely agree! Having a special car isn't about it being the easiest car to drive and which has plenty of space for groceries. Sure, as a daily commuter the 911 or most modern cars are better than their predecessors.

However, at the end of the day, what makes a car special is overall driving experience. Modern cars are bigger, more spacious, heavier, more luxurious, have more safety features, and exhaust systems with the sound piped into the speakers. Sure they have more power than their predecessors, but there's a great video of an interview with Alois Ruf. He has one of the earliest 911s ever made, restored it and still has it. His company built the fastest production car in the world in 1984 the Ruf "Yellow Bird." He regularly builds cars that have well in excess of 500hp, but he was quoted as saying nothing is better than lightness. He said even making cars with substantially more horsepower doesn't make up for the lightness and feel of earlier cars.

Most modern cars are automatics, which kind of kills the sports car feel and engagement with the car. I don't care how fast modern sports cars can go...its still sort of a "Soccer mom" car with an auto transmission.

There may be a handful of exceptions, but in most cases vintage cars with their quirks and imperfections have a lot more character and feel more special than most modern cars. I'd take a 930 Turbo over a modern 911 Turbo, a Ferrari 512BBi over a Ferrari 812, a Lamborghini Countach over an Aventator, a BMW 3.0CSL over an M8, a Maserati Bora over a Gran Turismo, Jag E-Type over an Ftype, etc. ...and I could keep going!