No Tags alignment points or Investment Price talk Then, Gruen And Aegler Movements.

[padi56]

The famous Techni-Quadron some information from Gruen web site ."Doctor's Watches" were so-called because the large seconds dial was handy for timing a patient's pulse. These however were not sold only to doctors. The watch was advertised as a timepiece for technicians and "radio and mechanical engineers"—anyone who needed to measure time in seconds. The 877 movement, manufactured by Aegler in Biel, was also used in the Rolex Prince; this unusual movement gives the watch its distinctive "dual dial" design. Hours and minutes are confined to the upper half of the dial, while the entire lower dial is dedicated to seconds. The Techni-Quadron provided a useful alternative to the tiny seconds hands on most watches from this era, which can be as little as 2mm , and are not practical to use for timing etc.


Aegler made movements for Rolex (which at this time had no own movement manufacturing capability]and has made Rolex movement ever since but now incorporated fully into the Rolex name.Gruen and Rolex were Aegler's biggest customers, and were both large shareholders as well. And the full company name at one time was, Aegler, Societe Anonyme, Fabrique des Montres Rolex & Gruen Guild A. Gruen and Rolex

Gruen sold their Aegler shares in the early 1930s,to Hans of Rolex after they moved all production to the Precision Factory(just another name to appear on a Rolex dial). About this time, Aegler became increasingly tied to Rolex through the sale of stock and shares.And Today, the main Rolex building in Biel is the old Aegler factory, and though it is now owned by Rolex, it is still run by the Aegler family.

A few mostly now forgotten names on Rolex dials.

Air Lion,Air-Tiger,Air-giant,Space-Dweller,SkyRocket,Speedking,Falcon,Orchid,Observat ory ,Tridor, Athlete,Commando,Turtle Timer,Canadian Empire, Oyster Lipton, Rolex Scientific,Rolex Everest,Tudor Advisor,Oyster Junior Sport, Oyster Raleigh, Oyster Commander, Oyster Recorda, Oyster Edison, Oyster Grenfell, Oyster Shipmate and Oyster Standard,and there are a quite a few more that I cannot remember now.

One of my own favourite vintage Rolex the Prince doctor dial below.

[Uhtred59]

[boogiebot]

Wow this is pretty cool. I have never seen or heard of this reference before. Thanks for sharing this and breaking the monotony of regular posts. I have always said, the amount of knowledge you have about this brand is crazy. Have a great day padi.


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[Brew]

Very cool. I was at one of my doctors this morning. I failed to check out his watch.

[schoolboy]

Originally Posted by Brew

Very cool. I was at one of my doctors this morning. I failed to check out his watch.

You failed to check someone’s wrist????

Sorry friend but we will have to issue infracción points for that

All jokes aside, I hope everything is well Brew!

By the way, I check wrists automatically hahaha

[Brew]

Originally Posted by schoolboy

You failed to check someone’s wrist????

Sorry friend but we will have to issue infracción points for that

All jokes aside, I hope everything is well Brew!

By the way, I check wrists automatically hahaha

Thanks Jess. Cardiologist says the bridge and tunnel work is good to go for another year.

[schoolboy]

Originally Posted by Brew

Thanks Jess. Cardiologist says the bridge and tunnel work is good to go for another year.

Awesome

[kieselguhr]

So that’s what the Cellini Prince was based on. Interesting. I really like that the Aegler family still runs the factory in Biel

SpaceDweller. I wonder what a reintroduction of that looks like.

[schoolboy]

Gruen?

I know I’ve seen that name around the watch scene.

[Chester01]

Another great post from the master! Always learn something new from your posts. I work in healthcare and find the second hand (as well as my chrono) absolute necessities.

[M45]

Makes me want to extol the virtues of Camel cigarettes to my patients.

Awesome watch.

[Avs Fan]

I remember seeing an article on the space dweller sometime ago! Can't remember where.

[padi56]

Originally Posted by Avs Fan

I remember seeing an article on the space dweller sometime ago! Can't remember where.

The Explorer type watch has had quite a few names its its life including Space-dweller, some say it was introduced to Japan only in 1963 after the Mercury astronauts paid a visit now they would fetch in around $30000 or more. The explorer is one of Rolex longest production runs,a great Rolex classic.The vintage 1016 is now becoming very collectable and original dialled space-dwellers now telephone money.Now the large triangle at '12' was first used by Rolex on the mixed Roman and Arabic dials in the 1940s. Rolex registered the Explorer name before the Everest expedition in 1953.And the first Explorers 6350 model used what they call the large bubble-back 10-1/2" A296 movement.Most of the early 6350 dials were also unusual in the fact that they are honeycombed a Rolex first.In 1963 the Explorer changed again,and with a new 1560 cal movement it was renamed the 1016 and it became the longest running explorer from 1963 right up to 1989.

Twenty six years without a much of a change ,the second version of the 1016 was really the second version of the 1560 calibre now called 1570 basically the same but now a hacking movement.Now these 15XX series movements IMHO are the finest Rolex has ever made.And around 1989 the Explorer disappeared from the Rolex catalogue but around 6 months was reintroduced,the new Explorer bearing the model 14270, sported a new case, dial, movement, and crystal. IMHO it was because of the Jackie Chan movies where he wears one, the Japanese market when crazy for Explorers,very much like Daytona fever today. And the Explorer at this time was very hard to get world wide just like Daytona today.At this time was changing hands for as much as double retail price.Now with these new modifications brought the Explorer in line with all the other Rolex models. And because the real cosmetics of the new watch was so much changed from that of the old one,like the 1016.Now the price in the vintage collectors market is going up and IMHO if you can get hold of a good 1016,IMO will only go up in serious value. And become a very collectable quite rare watch, and not like today's modern so called rare watches made in there thousands or more.

[beshannon]

Originally Posted by padi56

The famous Techni-Quadron some information from Gruen web site ."Doctor's Watches" were so-called because the large seconds dial was handy for timing a patient's pulse. These however were not sold only to doctors. The watch was advertised as a timepiece for technicians and "radio and mechanical engineers"—anyone who needed to measure time in seconds. The 877 movement, manufactured by Aegler in Biel, was also used in the Rolex Prince; this unusual movement gives the watch its distinctive "dual dial" design. Hours and minutes are confined to the upper half of the dial, while the entire lower dial is dedicated to seconds. The Techni-Quadron provided a useful alternative to the tiny seconds hands on most watches from this era, which can be as little as 2mm , and are not practical to use for timing etc.


Aegler made movements for Rolex (which at this time had no own movement manufacturing capability]and has made Rolex movement ever since but now incorporated fully into the Rolex name.Gruen and Rolex were Aegler's biggest customers, and were both large shareholders as well. And the full company name at one time was, Aegler, Societe Anonyme, Fabrique des Montres Rolex & Gruen Guild A. Gruen and Rolex

Gruen sold their Aegler shares in the early 1930s,to Hans of Rolex after they moved all production to the Precision Factory(just another name to appear on a Rolex dial). About this time, Aegler became increasingly tied to Rolex through the sale of stock and shares.And Today, the main Rolex building in Biel is the old Aegler factory, and though it is now owned by Rolex, it is still run by the Aegler family.

A few mostly now forgotten names on Rolex dials.

Air Lion,Air-Tiger,Air-giant,Space-Dweller,SkyRocket,Speedking,Falcon,Orchid,Observat ory ,Tridor, Athlete,Commando,Turtle Timer,Canadian Empire, Oyster Lipton, Rolex Scientific,Rolex Everest,Tudor Advisor,Oyster Junior Sport, Oyster Raleigh, Oyster Commander, Oyster Recorda, Oyster Edison, Oyster Grenfell, Oyster Shipmate and Oyster Standard,and there are a quite a few more that I cannot remember now.

One of my own favourite vintage Rolex the Prince doctor dial below.

Love the info Peter, thanks

Really love the Prince, that dial

[Ian Macdermott]

Thanks Peter an interesting read.

[77T]

Very nice bit if horological history, Peter.

Got me to looking for what the insides look like...side by side...the Rolex labeled and the Gruen...pic courtesy of Connoisseurs in Time and others on the interwebs.



Another sharp image.



Gruen knew how to market accuracy and the “old way” versus the new movement design.



In 1932 Rolex was marketing their Prince internationally...




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[padi56]

1930s Gruen doctors watch, used the same movement as the Rolex Prince but we must remember at this time Rolex were not allowed by agreement with Gruen to sell Rolex watches in the USA..As Rolex then only sold in Europe and commonwealth countries.



Many of the myths about Gruen, was that Gruen and Rolex at one time manufactured movements for each other's watches.This is not true, although both firms did use many of the same movements at this time the best known examples are the Gruen Tech Quadron and its twin, the Rolex Prince.In reality,these movements were made by a third party company Aegler, who was a very close neighbour to the Gruen Factory.

1930s Rolex Prince doctors style watch.Aegler movement.
and my own watch.

]

Modern 2005 Rolex Prince doctors style,myself prefer the 1930s model.

[sgwatchguy]

Fascinating. Thanks Peter


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[AshCashEmAll]

Very cool thanks for the informative and interesting read!


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[padi56]

Originally Posted by AshCashEmAll

Very cool thanks for the informative and interesting read!


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Well I do try but today not many are interested in Rolex history and what TRF was started for.

[CaliSpecial]

Originally Posted by padi56

Well I do try but today not many are interested in Rolex history and what TRF was started for.

I am very new here and I can only speak for myself but threads like this are the reason I joined TRF.

[padi56]

Originally Posted by CaliSpecial

I am very new here and I can only speak for myself but threads like this are the reason I joined TRF.

Many thanks just wish there were many more like you,but sadly thats not true with most all of today's newer forum members.

[77T]

Originally Posted by padi56

Many thanks just wish there were many more like you,but sadly thats not true with most all of today's newer forum members.

Peter
These are the contributions that are great for the benefit of all members.

I also applaud the renewed efforts Steve and the Mods are undertaking to rid TRF of the pesky “what’s it worth” and other pricing/valuations threads.

More meat, less spam...


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[garyk]

Originally Posted by padi56

Well I do try but today not many are interested in Rolex history and what TRF was started for.

Rolex has a fascinating history and I always enjoy hearing from someone who actually knows this history. Thank you!!

[Greg 59]

Fascinating stuff. Thanks for the history lesson.

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[Pongster]

Great post.

Turtle timer. Hmmm.

[Token74]

This is great, thank you Peter. One of these gems a day would be awesome!


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[brandrea]

Thank you for sharing this very informative post Peter.

Reading this, I can almost imagine in those early days how exciting the watch business was ... almost akin to what we see now in the technology space perhaps. Bright minds, tons of innovation, and eventually consolidation of industry leaders in their specialties.

I had NO idea of the history between the Aegler family with Rolex in the early days and up until now (if I understand correctly); very interesting.

Being Canadian, I’m especially interested in the Canadian Empire ... if you have a photo you could post that would be really great.

Thank you for sharing your knowledge with us.

[padi56]

Yes the movement side is still run by one of the original Aegler family but now fully owned by Rolex.Regarding Canadian Empire have not got a picture,I had a hard drive failure a few years back lost quite a bit of massed information yes I know should have backed it up.

[77T]

Originally Posted by padi56

Yes the movement side is still run by one of the original Aegler family but now fully owned by Rolex.Regarding Canadian Empire have not got a picture,I had a hard drive failure a few years back lost quite a bit of massed information yes I know should have backed it up.

Peter, you may have already tried this so only sharing in spirit of sharing.

If you still have the hard drive, it can be mailed to a Data Recovery company. The charge may be higher than the value of the data so usually a phone call will get you a quote.

Rescuing data from the undamaged sectors is possible but usually a single shot opportunity. Some inaccessible data might never be recovered but usually 90% of media can be saved.



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