Are all F series 16610lv's Flat Four's?

[nilel]

i have a kermit

mark 1 dial
Serial F090...

[bbturbo]

Originally Posted by joshtpa

I have one that I purchased in March 2004, Serial # is F0202XX. It came with a pointed 4.

This is a very interesting one; early F, pointed 4 and Mk2 dial...

[springer]

Originally Posted by Zed82

There are flat four all the way up to D-series. Check the reference list posted above.

No there are not. I've owned many F series and the flat 4s are found on the early F serials and the Ys. Besides the insert being unique on these early watches , so was the dial. I've never read anything substantive that would indicate otherwise.

[dcash0615]

I think I remember a thread where someone had a D serial LV with a flat 4, Mark III dial and oval O.

[Zed82]

Originally Posted by dcash0615

I think I remember a thread where someone had a D serial LV with a flat 4, Mark III dial and oval O.

There are D-serials available with flat four inserts. I have seen two myself and this is also indicated in the reference guide to 16610LV that’s often linked here.

[Casey VP-26]

Originally Posted by mjg002

To further specify, mine is F52xxx from October 2004 with mark 2 dial and pointed 4. So, yes, yours must be one of the very last Flat 4s.

Referring to this post and also posts #8 and #20 my question is were there 5 digit serial numbers used with letter designation on the 16610LV's?

[springer]

Originally Posted by Zed82

There are D-serials available with flat four inserts. I have seen two myself and this is also indicated in the reference guide to 16610LV that’s often linked here.

The Y and early F serials had the attributes for the first generation anniversary 16610LVs. Now that they are the most valuable, we see claims the D serials had the same attributes? You might have seen a D serial with a flat four but did it have the correct dial? I don't have to tell you that it has been 14 years since these watches were released and anything could have been changed on them to enhance the value. I have never heard of a D serial-numbered having the correct dial and insert as the early anniversary watches. It would be a "red flag" to most collectors I'm sure.

[rootbeer7]

Originally Posted by springer

The Y and early F serials had the attributes for the first generation anniversary 16610LVs. Now that they are the most valuable, we see claims the D serials had the same attributes? You might have seen a D serial with a flat four but did it have the correct dial? I don't have to tell you that it has been 14 years since these watches were released and anything could have been changed on them to enhance the value. I have never heard of a D serial-numbered having the correct dial and insert as the early anniversary watches. It would be a "red flag" to most collectors I'm sure.

This

[GB-man]

F09 here flat 4 mark I

[Duey]

Originally Posted by springer

The Y and early F serials had the attributes for the first generation anniversary 16610LVs. Now that they are the most valuable, we see claims the D serials had the same attributes? You might have seen a D serial with a flat four but did it have the correct dial? I don't have to tell you that it has been 14 years since these watches were released and anything could have been changed on them to enhance the value. I have never heard of a D serial-numbered having the correct dial and insert as the early anniversary watches. It would be a "red flag" to most collectors I'm sure.

Major Red Flag -

Also the LV's were not available until after the 3rd week of Nov 2003 - So if you find one dated September 2003, like it says in the little chart, that's another Red Flag -

Here's the Rolex USA letter dated November 14 2003 (that was a Friday too). So they can't be dated before then (earliest I've seen is 11/21/2003) ...

[Zed82]

Originally Posted by springer

The Y and early F serials had the attributes for the first generation anniversary 16610LVs. Now that they are the most valuable, we see claims the D serials had the same attributes? You might have seen a D serial with a flat four but did it have the correct dial? I don't have to tell you that it has been 14 years since these watches were released and anything could have been changed on them to enhance the value. I have never heard of a D serial-numbered having the correct dial and insert as the early anniversary watches. It would be a "red flag" to most collectors I'm sure.

This was my understanding as well until I saw an original D-series from the first owner with a fat four insert. Add to that the information in the reference guide that there are D-serials with fat four inserts and that I saw one more D-serial 16610LV with fat four after that. Who knows, maybe Rolex found a batch of old inserts and decided to use them up. Rolex have done so before.

[jay_kay]

Mine is an F5 serial and has a pointy 4 which I believe to be the original insert it came with from the factory. 'O' is not visible but is a squashed one!

[snipermaverick]

What's the difference between a mark 1 and mark 2 dial?

[okometsubu]

hi guys.
I have something in my hands and believe Zed82's idea.
Would this be a little help to think late F and early D have Flat 4?
F is Mk1 and D is Mk3 dial both HK paper dated Apr 2005.

[Kiddodoc]

Have an F4XXXX and it has the flat 4 with Mark1 dial. The bezel insert in mine is a lime green as the older series tend to have more of an emerald green.

[koryong]

I just bought a Kermit with a Mark 3 dial & flat-4 lime green insert - serial # is D19xxxx and guarantee certificate from a Monaco Rolex AD dated July 2005. It came from my most trusted dealer, who bought it from its first owner.

While current info resources about dial & insert variations have been generally accepted as "written in stone", I think they were mostly U.S. based and did not take into account, variations shipped to the rest of the world. As several years have now passed since those were published , we now see new differences from Europe & Asia here.

Perhaps someone would be kind enough to take the time to update the info ?

Just my 2 cents ... cheers, all

[Sebastian5]

What does 3 ticks and 5 ticks mean?

[skillman]

Sorry to revive an old topic… I recently purchased an early D series (D04) 16610 lv with the flat 4 serif bezel insert and an oval O, narrow spaced oyster perpetual date, 3 ticks swiss made dial. Warranty dates June 2005. Purchased in Asia.

[padi56]

Originally Posted by hopkinswatch22

I am getting more familiar with the differences between the serial numbers on the 16610lv "kermit" and understand that the Y and F series have the Mk 1 dials with the oval O and 5 ticks as well as the Flat four bezels. My question is did all of the F series watches have the oval O and flat four or were these only the earlier ones and the later ones had the regular O and the pointed 4.

All subs and the SD in this serial time range all have the flat four font insert, plus over the years its been used many times.Even been reports on forum of sending a point 4 insert 116610LV in for service, and came back with a flat four replacement bezel insert.And in the real world dials are made in 3 different factories now all owned by Rolex, so there always has been and always will be tiny variations to most all dials over production reference years.

[karleone]

Originally Posted by sensui

Yes only the y serials/earlier f serials have the flat four insert. Changed to pointed four sometime during mid f series.

They are random serial 16610LV witch flat four inserts as well… They are different from the ones on Y and F but still flat four.

[1665fan]

F5 flat 4 mark 1 dial over here

[ROLEX*]

It is mentioned as 2004 F serial, any idea which ‘Mark’?

Thanks



Ref: https://www.watchclub.com/curated-by...ry-sub-decoded

[ROLEX*]

Bump, is the watch collectible?

[geoach]

Have y962 mark 1 flat 4 with feet

[padi56]

Originally Posted by hopkinswatch22

I am getting more familiar with the differences between the serial numbers on the 16610lv "kermit" and understand that the Y and F series have the Mk 1 dials with the oval O and 5 ticks as well as the Flat four bezels. My question is did all of the F series watches have the oval O and flat four or were these only the earlier ones and the later ones had the regular O and the pointed 4.

The so called flat four and was on all Subs SD in same time frame as the introduction of the16610LV, plus its been used many times over the decades on most all of the sports dive line up. But now thanks to the Internet and those trying to make a say a 16610 into a LV and visa verso the price of the green insert have rocketing to almost ceramic prices. And now green insert is Rolex exchange only as independents cannot even get them now. Plus quite a few reports of later 16610LV with pointed fours after service new exchange green inserts 2014/15 using the same flat four font that was used around 2002/3 but slightly different colour.