Inspection periods?

[tenerific]

Had a bit of a, let’s just call it a “miscommunication”, with a dealer around inspection periods.

Short of it was that I received a vintage watch with some scratches on the bracelet that should have been disclosed (they were large scratches). Not the biggest of deals and if something’s in an inspection period who cares.

Issue was that I was incredibly busy until the end of the inspection period, which was given as 7 days. (Got to make money to fund watch habit so often crazy busy over here, lol).

So, watch arrives, 6 days pass. Finally carve out time to inspect (wasn’t expecting there to be an issue frankly) determine that I’d like to send the watch back, and am told, no, the inspection period started when the watch was purchased, so period was over.

Thing is, the seller was international. So from purchase it took like a day to ship and then 5 days or something for the watch to arrive.

What is the typical policy here? Do inspection periods start 1) when the item is purchased or 2) after it arrives?

Seems kind of pointless if it’s not #2

I have never quibbled with a dealer about these things (thankfully) so this is new territory for me.

[beshannon]

Originally Posted by tenerific

What is the typical policy here? Do inspection periods start 1) when the item is purchased or 2) after it arrives?

I would say the policy is up to the seller, there is no "typical"

[southtexas]

Post up a link to the ad, or at least copy and paste the inspection period language.

On its face, an “inspection period” should be just that...an amount of time for you to inspect an item. It should not include travel days where the watch hasn’t even reached you yet.

Also, regardless, if there’s a clock running, you should also share some responsibility...open your package and look at your multi-thousand dollar purchase!

All of the above depend heavily on exactly how the ad is worded.


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[tenerific]

Oh I do bear some responsibility - my life is incredibly hectic and I should have looked at it sooner. You do not want my life :-(


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[Syed117]

The inspection period starts the day you receive the watch. Doubt any good seller would argue against that.

We all get busy, but I think this one is on you.

Yes, the seller should have disclosed the scratches, but you had 7 days. Buying used is always tricky and you have to be diligent. I would have taken the time on the first day it arrived and looked over everything and it would have gone back out the next day if I wasn't satisfied.

[jimcameron]

Congratulations on the new to you, hectic lifestyle, vintage watch. Don't worry about the scratches, you'll get use to them.

[1665fan]

Post the dealer and the add...seems fishy to me

[tenerific]

Originally Posted by Syed117

The inspection period starts the day you receive the watch. Doubt any good seller would argue against that.



We all get busy, but I think this one is on you.



Yes, the seller should have disclosed the scratches, but you had 7 days. Buying used is always tricky and you have to be diligent. I would have taken the time on the first day it arrived and looked over everything and it would have gone back out the next day if I wasn't satisfied.

You're misinterpreting what I said. Despite the craziness around here, I inspected the watch WITHIN seven (actually six) days from the day the watch arrived. But the seller then insisted the inspection period began the day it was shipped to me (arrived 4 days later).

So, you all might quibble with my decision to wait, and view that as irresponsible, which it might be, but the fact is that I did things within the rules as they were set up. No disclaimer was given initially as to "oh yeah inspection period once I ship the watch and 4 days before you even see it"

[Syed117]

Originally Posted by tenerific

You're misinterpreting what I said. Despite the craziness around here, I inspected the watch WITHIN seven (actually six) days from the day the watch arrived. But the seller then insisted the inspection period began the day it was shipped to me (arrived 4 days later).



So, you all might quibble with my decision to wait, and view that as irresponsible, which it might be, but the fact is that I did things without the rules as they were set up. No disclaimer was given initially as to "oh yeah inspection period once I ship the watch and 4 days before you even see it"

Who is the inspection period for during transit? The mailman?

That's ridiculous.

[southtexas]

Please cut and paste the ad here, or at least any pertinent language from the ad.




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[tenerific]

Before I completely eviscerate the dealer, here are some snippets from our conversation in chronological order so you can get an idea -

September 7th, I ask:

"- Is there an inspection period / return policy"

September 7th, response:

"You have a 14 days inspection policy in France, 7 days abroad."

September 11th, payment made.
September 12th, payment received.
September 19th, in the evening, watch arrives.

Watch is finally inspected on September 25th, 6 days later. Seller is notified of return evening of the 25th, though probably the 26th their time. Still, within 7 days.

September 26th,

"The inspection period has passed so it cannot be returned has it was purchased 10 days ago and received 7 days ago.

I will certainly send you one of our new 100€ value crafted leather strap for you to enjoy the watch" He then tells me I can get the watch polished.

Me:

"How is the inspection period over if you said the inspection period was 7 days?"

Them:

"It is in written 5 days inspection for outside of EU and it’s been 7 days since you have received."

Me:

"You are incorrect. You told me, in this email thread, that inspection periods are as follows'

International fedex fast shipping is included.
Payments can be made by wire.
You have a 14 days inspection policy in France, 7 days abroad."

Them:

"I am sorry but even if it’s says 5 on my website and said 7, you've had 7 days to tell me"

Me:

"Here's what it says on your website. Note, this was buried in the terms and not on the ad itself

"We have a no-questions-asked 7-days return policy for European customers and a 5-days period for international customers. Insured return is at the cost of the customer. We will process the refund as soon as we receive the item and can confirm that it is in the same condition as it was when it left our office. For return, please email us at XXX"

I did not read this and went off what you said. What you said was:

'You have a 14 days inspection policy in France, 7 days abroad.'

Note that I confirmed this BEFORE I paid, as I always do.

I bear some of the responsibility here for not inspecting immediately and apologize for that. As I said, I am incredibly busy and it drives me crazy. BUT I did make sure to inspect within the period that you told me. Also, your website says no questions asked so the scratches shouldn't matter / exact reason why shouldn't matter. "

It continues back and forth like this, with no resolution. Essentially my read is that the seller doesn't want to take the watch back. But I do feel they should honor the fact that they told me what they told me? If I can't trust when they tell me in email when asked directly what am I to trust?!?! I mean really.

[tenerific]

I should also probably add that the watch was not shipped "International fedex fast shipping is included" and was shipped by post, and was left at my door, no signature required (!!)

[tenerific]

Another choice quote was that I have nothing to complain about because “I got a sweet deal” lol.

In other news, the seller has offered to source another bracelet but insists he did nothing wrong. I am starting to get pissed.


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[1665fan]

Out the seller sounds like bullshi***

[Chewbacca]

Here's what I think; keep it. You bought based on pics, some ambiguous seller policies, and you made a decision. You're not whole, but it could be worse.

Its not worth the hassle at this point to return, and you've already escalated with a foreign seller. Even if it were in the timeframe as understood by you, there's still costs to be absorbed in shipping and also potentially duties which could be deducted from your return. Everything that wasn't asked, clarified or noted is NOW up to interpretation - don't bother. You now know how this seller handles sales, imagine a return.

If it were a domestic seller, sure. Return it or ask for some goodwill like $100 back for your trouble.

In this case with overseas small seller or hobbyist buys, keep the watch. Its not worth it. Move on.

[turboevo2]

Post picture of the bracelet so we can see how bad it was. Bracelet can be buffed or changed I would also be concerned about the actual watch make sure movement is good and all. Also maybe tell us who the watch dealer was so that we maybe careful when making a purchase there. It sucks and the return policy is tricky. If he did not ship it international express they should at least give you extra time to inspect.

[southtexas]

Judging by the email, he’s trying to pencil whip you in the hopes that you’ll go away. If he’s a serious dealer, and concerned about his reputation, you might mention this thread to him.


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[tenerific]

Originally Posted by Chewbacca

Here's what I think; keep it. You bought based on pics, some ambiguous seller policies, and you made a decision. You're not whole, but it could be worse.

Its not worth the hassle at this point to return, and you've already escalated with a foreign seller. Even if it were in the timeframe as understood by you, there's still costs to be absorbed in shipping and also potentially duties which could be deducted from your return. Everything that wasn't asked, clarified or noted is NOW up to interpretation - don't bother. You now know how this seller handles sales, imagine a return.

If it were a domestic seller, sure. Return it or ask for some goodwill like $100 back for your trouble.

In this case with overseas small seller or hobbyist buys, keep the watch. Its not worth it. Move on.

This is very sensible. Thankfully it was <$5k (thank god thank god).

I do think this is a good case study on how to navigate these things in the future. And as good as a learning experience in vintage I could hope for, with probably minimal down side. Could have been MUCH worse.

Though that doesn’t change my opinion that this is some shady shit. I mean details matter and if you can’t stay true to your word - or even give the other party some wiggle room - your business is probably f*cked. I half feel like I’m dealing with a cable company or something, ha.


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[JParm]

Originally Posted by 1665fan

Out the seller sounds like bullshi***

I would also call out the seller.

[Chewbacca]

Originally Posted by tenerific

This is very sensible. Thankfully it was <$5k (thank god thank god).

I do think this is a good case study on how to navigate these things in the future. And as good as a learning experience in vintage I could hope for, with probably minimal down side. Could have been MUCH worse.

Though that doesn’t change my opinion that this is some shady shit. I mean details matter and if you can’t stay true to your word - or even give the other party some wiggle room - your business is probably f*cked. I half feel like I’m dealing with a cable company or something, ha.


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Exactly.

So why go back into the s__t?

Chalk it up to exp and enjoy the watch.

Anyone who reads this will ask the questions and hopefully avoid a repeat. That's a positive.

Lets see an incoming!!!!

[Captain Lee]

Out the seller. At best it's terrible customer service. At worst it's highly suspicious; like you said what *can* you trust, as this person clearly is not consistent?

You're well within reason to wait a few days to open a package and discuss an issue with it during the agreed upon inspection period. Seller is in the wrong based on everything you have said.

[OpusXIII]

I think you should have opened the box and inspected the damn thing upon receipt. NO ONE is 'that' busy. Hell, you seem to have time to putz around on here asking for stranger's opinions on the matter. Regardless of the seller's policy, this one's on you. Maybe next time you order something of like value, you'll open it up and check it out instead of relying upon some 'timeline' and doing the last minute thing.

[Cooper33]

Originally Posted by OpusXIII

I think you should have opened the box and inspected the damn thing upon receipt. NO ONE is 'that' busy. Hell, you seem to have time to putz around on here asking for stranger's opinions on the matter. Regardless of the seller's policy, this one's on you. Maybe next time you order something of like value, you'll open it up and check it out instead of relying upon some 'timeline' and doing the last minute thing.

Either way he was within the deadline.

I'm pretty sure any inspection period from a legal standpoint can only start from the moment you are in possession of the watch - the fight would be to prove when possession actually started. The basic assumption being you cannot inspect what you cannot see. Having said that, I wouldn't trust a seller that is creating this kind of issue with returning the watch and then waiting for my money. Who knows what will be next? "Oh, there is actually a return fee now" etc.

Finally, as someone with a few years of legal experience, as the saying goes "paper accepts everything". Be very weary on relying on a piece of paper or any online "warranty" for that matter, especially when you are dealing with international goods. Its easy to think that you always have legal resource against bad intentions, but the reality of the matter is that by the time you start thinking about it, researching lawyers overseas, gathering documents and initiating any legal battle, months have gone by, your patience is gone, you'll have spent a couple of grand and it will not be worth the hassle unless we're talking about some serious bucks. Even then, it may take months or even years for you to recover. Just my 2 cents.

[Panos Cosmatos]

Originally Posted by OpusXIII

I think you should have opened the box and inspected the damn thing upon receipt. NO ONE is 'that' busy. Hell, you seem to have time to putz around on here asking for stranger's opinions on the matter. Regardless of the seller's policy, this one's on you. Maybe next time you order something of like value, you'll open it up and check it out instead of relying upon some 'timeline' and doing the last minute thing.

Damn dude, good grief. He was told seven days. He received it and made a mental note to look at the watch within that period. If he was as busy as he says, he would actually be stupid to take time out of his day (displacing time to be spent on more urgent tasks) to do this non-urgent task. When a serious party states a timeline, his counterpart is not in the wrong to assume that timeline will be honored, like any other part of the deal.

Also, how is he “putzing around” by asking for opinions on here? This seems like the perfect place to ask.

OP I think you are clearly in the right here, the guy expressly told you seven days in a direct email to you and you looked at it within that period. There is no grey here. Seller is not honoring his side of the bargain and I agree you should out him. That said i agree with the poster above that depending on the severity of the scratching, given the difficulties in shipping it back international it may be less trouble for you to seek another solution. Seller, instead of sending you a “$100 value” strap, should just send you the amount it takes to make this right.


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[tenerific]

Originally Posted by OpusXIII

I think you should have opened the box and inspected the damn thing upon receipt. NO ONE is 'that' busy. Hell, you seem to have time to putz around on here asking for stranger's opinions on the matter. Regardless of the seller's policy, this one's on you. Maybe next time you order something of like value, you'll open it up and check it out instead of relying upon some 'timeline' and doing the last minute thing.

I don’t think you understand how busy I am. I wish I was exaggerating.

PS point taken

PPS I did follow the rules though and would have followed them if the inspection period was shorter.


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[tenerific]

Latest correspondence:

"Paid twice for FedEx but they never sent me the papers by email, system was down, it was send by the FedEx of France and took the same amount of time. For the signature thing it happened to 3 of my customers because staff is not the same during vacation with fedex especially and since I was leaving and needed to send, I sent (for the same price and time) with what I had offered.
This will be the end of the discussion as I have to justify every single thing for a scratch."

FUN FUN FUN!

[LigerBelair]

Originally Posted by jpeezy14@hotmail.com

I would also call out the seller.

Agreed. I, for one, want to know who this vendor is so I can avoid doing business with him in the future.

[beshannon]

Originally Posted by tenerific

Though that doesn’t change my opinion that this is some shady shit. I mean details matter and if you can’t stay true to your word - or even give the other party some wiggle room - your business is probably f*cked. I half feel like I’m dealing with a cable company or something, ha.

Was this a Rolex watch purchased from a seller with an ad on this forum?

[othertbone]

Originally Posted by tenerific

Had a bit of a, let’s just call it a “miscommunication”, with a dealer around inspection periods.

Short of it was that I received a vintage watch with some scratches on the bracelet that should have been disclosed (they were large scratches). Not the biggest of deals and if something’s in an inspection period who cares.

Issue was that I was incredibly busy until the end of the inspection period, which was given as 7 days. (Got to make money to fund watch habit so often crazy busy over here, lol).

So, watch arrives, 6 days pass. Finally carve out time to inspect (wasn’t expecting there to be an issue frankly) determine that I’d like to send the watch back, and am told, no, the inspection period started when the watch was purchased, so period was over.

Thing is, the seller was international. So from purchase it took like a day to ship and then 5 days or something for the watch to arrive.

What is the typical policy here? Do inspection periods start 1) when the item is purchased or 2) after it arrives?

Seems kind of pointless if it’s not #2

I have never quibbled with a dealer about these things (thankfully) so this is new territory for me.

Every seller is different. The thing is to understand exactly how the purchase and return works before you work with a dealer. Then you must check the merchandise right when it arrives. Best to use a reputable local seller or a very well known online seller and understand all their policies, especially for a newbie.

I know this doesn't help now, but I'm just answering your question. Hope it will work out for you brother.

[tenerific]

Originally Posted by othertbone

Every seller is different. The thing is to understand exactly how the purchase and return works before you work with a dealer. Then you must check the merchandise right when it arrives. Best to use a reputable local seller or a very well known online seller and understand all their policies, especially for a newbie.



I know this doesn't help now, but I'm just answering your question. Hope it will work out for you brother.

Yeah so the return policy was pretty clear and I asked about it pointedly. But no one can control people going back on their word unfortunately. My rule #1 is “don’t be a dick” but that is becoming a rarer things these days.

I suspect the watch was hard for them to move and for all we know they already spent the funds, ha.

I will reply back with seller’s details and more correspondence. At the very least I hope this is entertaining for you all!


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