AD prices are like a 1000 USD more than trusted sellers?

[rollerball]

What I understand is that private (non AD) sellers buy their stocks from AD's and profit from exchange rate differences between countries, tax / VAT rebates (mainly) or tax free and of course standard allowable AD discounts. That's why the set is usually from a different country. And because they are buy so many ROLEX from the same few AD overseas, they have built a solid relationship and thus able to get some popular models.

As for me, I would prefer to get from AD's due to better customer service as well as after sales support (mainly exchanges due to faults which I would not want to bring to RSC to open up the back case) during the first few days of sale.

It's OK to get non-AD sets but you would have to be really really careful that you do not get a faulty set and dropped set that you only realize after a few days later, or worse, a stolen set which you would only realize 5 years down the road when you bring it down to RSC. But most of the time, its OK to get an non-AD set.

[vubui]

I buy from a single dealer in Stockholm, and the first time I went in they gave me a $1000 discount without me asking for it or even being unsure of my purchase. I went in and told them what I wanted, we chatted a bit while my girlfriend tried on watches trying to find the one I was buying her for Christmas, and when it came time to pay for mine he had rung it up at $1000 less. I asked about the price discrepancy and he said he was giving me a "little discount". I've since bought 2 more watches, both with discounts I didn't negotiate or ask for and brought a friend to buy his Sub C there a week later, also with a discount, again not asked for. All of the discounts have been for more than 10%.

Sometimes you need to make a relationship first, sometimes you find a great AD who treats you well and a relationship forms after that.

[PTBoat]

Hi, I'm new here, I am ready to buy a Sea Dweller 4000. I have seen David sw name come up in a few posts. How do i know of a trusted sellers reputation as I am very new to this community?

Thanks.

[hosam112]

Originally Posted by PTBoat

Hi, I'm new here, I am ready to buy a Sea Dweller 4000. I have seen David sw name come up in a few posts. How do i know of a trusted sellers reputation as I am very new to this community?

Thanks.

Go to Who is who section in this forum...use the search function. Type the name of the seller you want...you will see the reviews there.

By the way..DavidSW is one of the most trusted sellers here. You have no worries. You also have Takuya, Bodybump, Jizeal...to name a few.

[I-luv-Rolex]

Originally Posted by Jbranda

Maybe with your AD. Its all about how u approach the sale and negotiate. If one AD doesnt give you the price you want...move on to the other until you find the best deal

plus one more.

[I-luv-Rolex]

Originally Posted by rollerball

What I understand is that private (non AD) sellers buy their stocks from AD's and profit from exchange rate differences between countries, tax / VAT rebates (mainly) or tax free and of course standard allowable AD discounts. That's why the set is usually from a different country. And because they are buy so many ROLEX from the same few AD overseas, they have built a solid relationship and thus able to get some popular models.

As for me, I would prefer to get from AD's due to better customer service as well as after sales support (mainly exchanges due to faults which I would not want to bring to RSC to open up the back case) during the first few days of sale.

It's OK to get non-AD sets but you would have to be really really careful that you do not get a faulty set and dropped set that you only realize after a few days later, or worse, a stolen set which you would only realize 5 years down the road when you bring it down to RSC. But most of the time, its OK to get an non-AD set.

So what you got to do to make sure you don't have any problem is check the statue of limitation for stolen goods in your area and make sure you don't take it into RSC before then. Remember that guy who has hundreds of stolen art that belong to Jewish concentration camp victims. Well, he did not have to give them back because apparently the limitation for stolen goods in germany was 30 years.

[RollieVerde]

Rolex only sells watches to ADs. Where these Trusted Sellers get their stock? I have no idea. If you're going to spend thousands of dollars on watch you plan on keeping for a very long time, do you want to buy from somebody who has no connection to Rolex in order to save a few bucks? I guess if you're a collector/flipper and the timepiece is just another piece of jewelry to you it wouldn't much matter. ADs are like any other business entity in that some are great, some not so much. But if they are an AD and you have a problem you can contact Rolex directly (in the USA that's NYC) and they can help get the problem sorted. Trusted Sellers get their reputation from forums like this and word of mouth, and some are no doubt first class businesspeople who go the extra mile to keep you as a customer. But every discount comes with a price. In a non-AD transaction, you don't have as much recourse should something go amiss.

[SMD]

Originally Posted by RollieVerde

In a non-AD transaction, you don't have as much recourse should something go amiss.

Except of course, for that thingy called the warranty!

[mfer]

Originally Posted by jjnd08

Just like everything in life, it's all about relationships.

This! The trusted sellers have these in spades with many many people. Keeping those relationships is their full time job and not an entirely easy task.

There are also many members here who have those relationships. Those are not bragged about for obvious reasons.

[subtona]

Originally Posted by perpetualman88

sorry but this is not correct (IMO)

Its all about your relationship with the AD. to Building relationships takes time and a lot of money to be very general about it

Originally Posted by DCheeta

Are you saying that it's not true that ADs have to pay rent, payroll, etc? Or are you saying its not true that online sellers work from home? Or is it not true that everyone has bills to pay?

I'm confused at to which part is not correct.

to put it another way:

Your trusted seller buys from an AD... ie the discount originates at the AD.

bnib from trusted seller, discount comes from AD

preowned is different story…


as the other post says, it is about the relationship.

[Furbo]

For a 1000USD difference I would rather try to get some discount and buy from AD.

[sheldonsmith]

No received my SD4000 from DavidSW. Great transaction. All good.

[hosam112]

Originally Posted by RollieVerde

Rolex only sells watches to ADs. Where these Trusted Sellers get their stock? I have no idea. If you're going to spend thousands of dollars on watch you plan on keeping for a very long time, do you want to buy from somebody who has no connection to Rolex in order to save a few bucks? I guess if you're a collector/flipper and the timepiece is just another piece of jewelry to you it wouldn't much matter. ADs are like any other business entity in that some are great, some not so much. But if they are an AD and you have a problem you can contact Rolex directly (in the USA that's NYC) and they can help get the problem sorted. Trusted Sellers get their reputation from forums like this and word of mouth, and some are no doubt first class businesspeople who go the extra mile to keep you as a customer. But every discount comes with a price. In a non-AD transaction, you don't have as much recourse should something go amiss.

I got my rolex sub from Takuya after posting this thread....I got it and saved 1100 USD....any difference from AD? The only difference is I saved like I said 1100 USD. By the way, the watch I got, came straight from AD. So what it seems is that simply these sellers established long relationships with ADs that they can get such great prices from. It came with warranty cards, manuals, double box, and EVERYTHING that an AD would give you!

I went with it to RSC and they didn't even ask any questions regarding warranty or anything. They just gave me a nice service.

If you ever have a problem with your watch, there is this thing called warranty that protects you and your watch, regardless where you got it from...even if you got it from someone on the street...as long as it is a legit warranty.

[MonBK]

Originally Posted by hosam112

I got my rolex sub from Takuya after posting this thread....I got it and saved 1100 USD....any difference from AD? The only difference is I saved like I said 1100 USD. By the way, the watch I got, came straight from AD. So what it seems is that simply these sellers established long relationships with ADs that they can get such great prices from. It came with warranty cards, manuals, double box, and EVERYTHING that an AD would give you!

I went with it to RSC and they didn't even ask any questions regarding warranty or anything. They just gave me a nice service.

If you ever have a problem with your watch, there is this thing called warranty that protects you and your watch, regardless where you got it from...even if you got it from someone on the street...as long as it is a legit warranty.

What kind of service did it need?

[hosam112]

Originally Posted by MonBK

What kind of service did it need?

Well, not service in the actual term. But simple sizing by removing a link or 2 to get the best fit.

But the fact is, they didn't even ask for any warranty or anything. They simply took my name down and took the watch to the back that's all. I was done in like 15 minutes.

The point is, no matter where you got it from, what matters is the warranty and if it's legit, you are all good to go.

Aside from the AD experience, I can't see how it is a smart move to buy from AD over a trusted seller in here. But to each their own.

[Anthon]

It still makes no sense to me. All in all I think it is a great marketing ploy used by the clever Swiss chaps at Rolex headquarters. AD, TS, they still make a ton of money on each watch! They still dictate the price, they still dictate supply, they know exactly who sells their watches, whilst we on the forums squabble in the margin about a 1000 dollar discount here or there in stead of asking more directly if we pay a fair price.

[hosam112]

Originally Posted by Anthon

It still makes no sense to me. All in all I think it is a great marketing ploy used by the clever Swiss chaps at Rolex headquarters. AD, TS, they still make a ton of money on each watch! The still dictate the price, they still dictate supply, the know exactly who sells their watches, whilst we on the forums squabble in the margin about a 1000 dollar discount here or there in stead of asking more directly if we pay a fair price.

And even if that's true. What's the issue as long as we keep finding great prices here?

[Rameez-Q]

As already said, A lot of grey dealers are able to buy in bulk from AD's who have too much stock & need to offload a lot for less profit.

A local pre owned rolex seller in my area confirmed this, he is able to source BNIB unworn watches at decent discounts

[408cissss]

That's why I do most my shopping here with the trusted seller here

[RollieVerde]

Originally Posted by hosam112

I got my rolex sub from Takuya after posting this thread....I got it and saved 1100 USD....any difference from AD? The only difference is I saved like I said 1100 USD. By the way, the watch I got, came straight from AD. So what it seems is that simply these sellers established long relationships with ADs that they can get such great prices from. It came with warranty cards, manuals, double box, and EVERYTHING that an AD would give you!

I went with it to RSC and they didn't even ask any questions regarding warranty or anything. They just gave me a nice service.

If you ever have a problem with your watch, there is this thing called warranty that protects you and your watch, regardless where you got it from...even if you got it from someone on the street...as long as it is a legit warranty.

How is that possible? Either you purchased it from an AD or you didn't. It came straight from an AD? Then who is the is middleman who somehow siphoned off $1100 dollars from the price? You've already taken it into an RSC for service? Was it a warranty claim? I don't believe any of this stuff. If you didn't buy it from and AD and they registered the warranty on the day (see below) it isn't a legitimate warranty. You actually think an AD is going to give a big discount (which comes right out of their margin) to somebody who's going to turn around and sell it for more to a 3rd party? Seriously? Unless they're paying off the salesman somehow, this makes no sense.

One of these days it wouldn't surprise me if Rolex decides to alter their fairly loose "warranty goes with the watch, not the owner" policy. The latest warranty cards are much harder to fake, as they are coded with a strip like a credit card and are read when you buy the watch so Rolex knows exactly where/when each watch is sold and when the warranty begins. In addition to this, the AD sends in a form to Rolex with all the info to start the warranty. If an AD sells a watch at a substantial discount, many times it doesn't include the warranty card. A lot of online sellers just buy fake cards in bulk, a box on ebay, and sell it as BNIB. The Rolex warranty states, "Your Rolex is covered by a two-year international warranty. Every Rolex watch comes with a warranty card that certifies its authenticity. This warranty card must be completed and dated by your Official Rolex Jeweler at time of purchase."

The Tudor warranty says the same thing. Completed includes filling in the name of the purchaser. Nobody that's not an AD can issue you a legitimate card, but they do it anyway. And I doubt they have the form I mentioned earlier that the AD now sends in. Rolex hasn't cracked down on all this stuff-yet. But if they decide they've had enough, they could very easily do it and deny warranty service if the watch wasn't originally purchased at an AD by the individual making the claim. There's nothing in the warranty that says its transferable, and as I said, one of the things that has to be filled out and registered w/Rolex is the name of the purchaser. The latest cards make tracking the purchase much easier.

One of the reasons Rolex hasn't done anything about this is I think the actually number of watches that have required warranty work in the first two years is fairly small, and they like to keep owners happy in general because it's good for business and it's the seller they have the issue with, not the end buyer. But they could tighten things up whenever they want, should they decide they need to. Out of warranty Rolex will service any Rolex or Tudor and take your money, as long as the watch is legit and wasn't modified or stolen. From the service side it only matters where the watch was purchased in warranty claims, and they've been very generous about this for a long time.

Bottom line: if a deal is more important to you than where the watch came from (and you'll probably just flip it anyway), go the non-AD route. If you're buying a watch to keep & wear for decades and want to start a good relationship w/Rolex, buy from a legitimate AD.

[GB-man]

Originally Posted by RollieVerde

How is that possible? Either you purchased it from an AD or you didn't. It came straight from an AD? Then who is the is middleman who somehow siphoned off $1100 dollars from the price? You've already taken it into an RSC for service? Was it a warranty claim? I don't believe any of this stuff. If you didn't buy it from and AD and they registered the warranty on the day (see below) it isn't a legitimate warranty. You actually think an AD is going to give a big discount (which comes right out of their margin) to somebody who's going to turn around and sell it for more to a 3rd party? Seriously? Unless they're paying off the salesman somehow, this makes no sense.

One of these days it wouldn't surprise me if Rolex decides to alter their fairly loose "warranty goes with the watch, not the owner" policy. The latest warranty cards are much harder to fake, as they are coded with a strip like a credit card and are read when you buy the watch so Rolex knows exactly where/when each watch is sold and when the warranty begins. In addition to this, the AD sends in a form to Rolex with all the info to start the warranty. If an AD sells a watch at a substantial discount, many times it doesn't include the warranty card. A lot of online sellers just buy fake cards in bulk, a box on ebay, and sell it as BNIB. The Rolex warranty states, "Your Rolex is covered by a two-year international warranty. Every Rolex watch comes with a warranty card that certifies its authenticity. This warranty card must be completed and dated by your Official Rolex Jeweler at time of purchase."

The Tudor warranty says the same thing. Completed includes filling in the name of the purchaser. Nobody that's not an AD can issue you a legitimate card, but they do it anyway. And I doubt they have the form I mentioned earlier that the AD now sends in. Rolex hasn't cracked down on all this stuff-yet. But if they decide they've had enough, they could very easily do it and deny warranty service if the watch wasn't originally purchased at an AD by the individual making the claim. There's nothing in the warranty that says its transferable, and as I said, one of the things that has to be filled out and registered w/Rolex is the name of the purchaser. The latest cards make tracking the purchase much easier.

One of the reasons Rolex hasn't done anything about this is I think the actually number of watches that have required warranty work in the first two years is fairly small, and they like to keep owners happy in general because it's good for business and it's the seller they have the issue with, not the end buyer. But they could tighten things up whenever they want, should they decide they need to. Out of warranty Rolex will service any Rolex or Tudor and take your money, as long as the watch is legit and wasn't modified or stolen. From the service side it only matters where the watch was purchased in warranty claims, and they've been very generous about this for a long time.

Bottom line: if a deal is more important to you than where the watch came from (and you'll probably just flip it anyway), go the non-AD route. If you're buying a watch to keep & wear for decades and want to start a good relationship w/Rolex, buy from a legitimate AD.

With all due respect you're not well versed on the grey market. I'm not going to explain the obvious because deals happen between the buyer and seller, but there's no conspiracy and trusted sellers here are just that.

[hosam112]

Originally Posted by RollieVerde

How is that possible? Either you purchased it from an AD or you didn't. It came straight from an AD? Then who is the is middleman who somehow siphoned off $1100 dollars from the price? You've already taken it into an RSC for service? Was it a warranty claim? I don't believe any of this stuff. If you didn't buy it from and AD and they registered the warranty on the day (see below) it isn't a legitimate warranty. You actually think an AD is going to give a big discount (which comes right out of their margin) to somebody who's going to turn around and sell it for more to a 3rd party? Seriously? Unless they're paying off the salesman somehow, this makes no sense.

One of these days it wouldn't surprise me if Rolex decides to alter their fairly loose "warranty goes with the watch, not the owner" policy. The latest warranty cards are much harder to fake, as they are coded with a strip like a credit card and are read when you buy the watch so Rolex knows exactly where/when each watch is sold and when the warranty begins. In addition to this, the AD sends in a form to Rolex with all the info to start the warranty. If an AD sells a watch at a substantial discount, many times it doesn't include the warranty card. A lot of online sellers just buy fake cards in bulk, a box on ebay, and sell it as BNIB. The Rolex warranty states, "Your Rolex is covered by a two-year international warranty. Every Rolex watch comes with a warranty card that certifies its authenticity. This warranty card must be completed and dated by your Official Rolex Jeweler at time of purchase."

The Tudor warranty says the same thing. Completed includes filling in the name of the purchaser. Nobody that's not an AD can issue you a legitimate card, but they do it anyway. And I doubt they have the form I mentioned earlier that the AD now sends in. Rolex hasn't cracked down on all this stuff-yet. But if they decide they've had enough, they could very easily do it and deny warranty service if the watch wasn't originally purchased at an AD by the individual making the claim. There's nothing in the warranty that says its transferable, and as I said, one of the things that has to be filled out and registered w/Rolex is the name of the purchaser. The latest cards make tracking the purchase much easier.

One of the reasons Rolex hasn't done anything about this is I think the actually number of watches that have required warranty work in the first two years is fairly small, and they like to keep owners happy in general because it's good for business and it's the seller they have the issue with, not the end buyer. But they could tighten things up whenever they want, should they decide they need to. Out of warranty Rolex will service any Rolex or Tudor and take your money, as long as the watch is legit and wasn't modified or stolen. From the service side it only matters where the watch was purchased in warranty claims, and they've been very generous about this for a long time.

Bottom line: if a deal is more important to you than where the watch came from (and you'll probably just flip it anyway), go the non-AD route. If you're buying a watch to keep & wear for decades and want to start a good relationship w/Rolex, buy from a legitimate AD.

Are you serious? First off, it wasn't an actual service as in something was wrong with it. It just needed sizing as it is a new watch.

You don't know whether I will flip the watch or not so you can't judge. Actually, I plan to keep it for a very long long time. The warranty I got is as legit as it goes. All these trusted sellers here have been selling watches for very very long time and they get their pieces from AD..if anything was wrong with such a move or with the warranty itself, they wouldn't last that long. Take for example most famous trusted sellers here like DavidSW, Takuya, Bodybump...you telling me there is anything wrong with that? Hence your line "if a deal is more important to you than where it came from? It did come from an AD. The AD stamp is right on it DUH!

I said I think it came straight from AD as the box itself shows the return address as the AD name and the address. So yes, it did ship from the AD....you wonder about the deep discount? Because the middleman (in this case the seller here in this forum) has a good relationship with that AD so he got a good price for me while probably also taking something for himself, not sure how much!

Even if the warranty policy changes to warranty goes with owner not with watch....my name is right on the warranty card as well! So in either case,

It is up to you whether you want to buy from here or from AD....but to me, both ways are as legit as it goes. Many many experts here can attest to that.

You don't have to believe any of the stuff I just said....but it is exactly what happened and I believe it. I'm sure many people here have received and went through the same experience I got.

[ajg1960]

With all this talk about worrying if the warranty is/isn't valid, coupled with the impeccably fine craftsmanship of a Rolex watch-- isn't it a fair statement to say that an extremely small percentage of these watches need service under warranty?? Is al this warranty worry for nothing??

[M777]

No disrespect to those who insist on buying their timepiece at the AD and getting a 0-10%discount vs buying from a trusted seller (middleman). To me buying from any AD is the equivalent of taking a stack of hundred dollar bills and setting them on fire (unless you manage to get a outrageous discount).

From what I understand most of the sellers on this forum will provide you with a warranty card stamped by the AD and your name on it. If you buy from a place like jomashop you don't get a warranty card but they provide their own warranty.

[blue lion]

I've wondered myself how the trust sellers get their watches. It would be interesting to see a reply from 1 of them to confirm. I don't doubt their honesty or reputation, and maybe they are buying from their local AD at a discount due to their relationship or quantity of purchases.
Good thread.

[Anthon]

Until someone can very clearly and unambiguously explain in less than 20 words how the price drops by more than $1000 AD to TS, there will still be a case for buying your watch the official AD way.

What I see in these forums is more akin to people trying to find a reason (overstock/no overhead/it comes straight from the AD???) than real solid reasons.

[Speed]

Originally Posted by Jim Smyth

No trusted seller would buy strictly all of the less popular models. There has to be some good ones in there too to make it attractive. It has to be a good working relationship for both sides. The AD's need to move A LOT of watches. I am sure Rolex is well aware of this but cant control it completely. Plus why would they. They sell more watches and still keep the reputation this way.

I would also bet that trusted sellers have (more) than one AD relationship - hence they have more desirable pieces than simply a ton of Date Justs / Oyster Perpetuals with wacky dials!

[M777]

Originally Posted by Anthon

Until someone can very clearly and unambiguously explain in less than 20 words how the price drops by more than $1000 AD to TS, there will still be a case for buying your watch the official AD way.

What I see in these forums is more akin to people trying to find a reason (overstock/no overhead/it comes straight from the AD???) than real solid reasons.

TS seller gets a substantial discount from the AD (AD knows that he isn't a mystery shopper and that he buys volume). TS makes a profit and the AD moves the goods quickly without fear of getting caught red handed by rolex selling at a discount. It's a win win situation.

More than 20 words, sorry.

[mannyv11]

Originally Posted by Anthon

Until someone can very clearly and unambiguously explain in less than 20 words how the price drops by more than $1000 AD to TS, there will still be a case for buying your watch the official AD way.

What I see in these forums is more akin to people trying to find a reason (overstock/no overhead/it comes straight from the AD???) than real solid reasons.

A lot of the trusted sellers have more than 500k in inventory. If I was spending that much money with an ad I would want a substantial discount lets say 25 percent on stainless steel models. They sell it to people on the forum at 10-15 percent off and they make 10-15 percent. How is that difficult to understand. Watches come from an ad with the warranty. Seems pretty simple

[handsfull]

I bought a BRAND NEW IN BOX (never worn/tried on/touched/etc,etc) Datejust from a trusted seller here. It came with my name on the BRAND NEW WARRANTY card, dated appropriately. Saved 22% from retail. Out of 4 local dealers, not one could even come CLOSE to saving 5 to 10%.

This is what is called a 'NO brainer'.