Zenith's changing definition of what L.E. means.....

[MoosicPa]

I see that Zenith is up to it's old trick of creating additional pieces to their advertised Limited Edition Pieces. Last year at Basel they released the Aeronef 20 in a limited edition of 250 pieces in Titanium, and I think 38 in Rose Gold. Well, now Zenith has released 5 additional pieces in Titanium in a special addition for Zegg & Cerlati in Monte Carlo... bringing the titanium L.E. pieces up to 255..... I wonder how many more of these L.E. pieces they will actually produce? They did the same thing with the Vintage 1955 watch which was also supposed to have been a L.E. of 250 pieces when first released. The next year they released another 250 pieces with a black dial, and then the following year an additional 250 pieces with a brown dial bringing the actual number of pieces to 750. This leaves a bad taste with me about Zenith. When I purchase a piece that is supposed to be a L.E. I expect it to be that and not subject to change in the total number of pieces they later decide to add.

[NCD1979]

Good point. I too expect a L.E.purchase to remain a known quantity. This is among the reasons why Zenith has lost popularity over the past several years, IMHO.

[malarky_hk]

This "limited edition" gimmick is prevalent in all the brands not just Zenith. However, I still love Zenith.

[unknown]

I know what you mean but I am not sure your info is correct.
I'm aware of those 5 pieces for the dealer in Monaco.

BUT are you sure these are 5 extra pieces ?

I would think that dealer got 5 pieces and decided to personlalize them ( imo mess them up because that watch was so nice in titanium, it doesn't need a black coating and the logo from their shop on the dial ... are they mad ? )

Anyway I think they got these pieces, asked somebody to DLC them, mess up the dial and put another plaque on the side of the watch. One that says x/5 instead of xxx/250

So I would rather think there are now 245 in titanium and not 250.

[unknown]

one thing I forgot.
When you were talking about the 1955 ... every brand does it
One year it looks like this ant the next year they change the dial, hands, or something else and call it another LE
Panerai is the king LOL

About your Type 20 ... Don't worry
You have one of the most unique watches of the planet.
That 5011K movement is VERY rare and they don't make it anymore. They just can't make a few hundred extra :-)

[MoosicPa]

The article I read about the MC pieces did not specify whether they were part of the original 250 L.E. pieces. However, we know that they presold their original offering of 250 pieces at Basel last Spring, I find it difficult to believe they held 5 of those watches for one buyer. Additionally, the 5011 movements were refurbished movements they discovered in their warehouse. They never disclosed how many of these ebauches they discovered, so they very well may be sitting on a couple hundred, or thousand movements.
Based upon Zenith's past performance, there may be unlimited "limited" editions of the Aeronef.

[unknown]

Originally Posted by MoosicPa

The article I read about the MC pieces did not specify whether they were part of the original 250 L.E. pieces. However, we know that they presold their original offering of 250 pieces at Basel last Spring, I find it difficult to believe they held 5 of those watches for one buyer. Additionally, the 5011 movements were refurbished movements they discovered in their warehouse. They never disclosed how many of these ebauches they discovered, so they very well may be sitting on a couple hundred, or thousand movements.
Based upon Zenith's past performance, there may be unlimited "limited" editions of the Aeronef.

yes they were all presold but does this make any difference ?

They were presold to boutiques ans AD's right, you nor I can't order something directly at Basel or SIHH.
Those 250 were sold to dealers. In fact Zenith had a much bigger demand. I've read they could have sold 700 or 800 the first day , the second day they told they were all presold several times.

So when that AD finally gets it 5 pieces they can do whatever they want with them. And I guess they modified their 5 pieces.

I think Zenith had a 400 or 450 of these calibers
Some of them were probably broken or unusable and these were used to make 300 or 400 good calibers
250 in titanium and 75 in gold ( 325 in total)

I hope they still have one left
You know, every year there is a special auction. Charity auction called 'only watch' several brand (zenith included) do make 1 very unique watch and the entire amount goes to charity. The watches are sold via antiquorum.
I really hope Zenith offers this year a unique type 20. Why not 1 in platinum.

Doing so this watch will even get more succes and become more collectible

[MoosicPa]

Originally Posted by unknown

yes they were all presold but does this make any difference ?

They were presold to boutiques ans AD's right, you nor I can't order something directly at Basel or SIHH.
Those 250 were sold to dealers. In fact Zenith had a much bigger demand. I've read they could have sold 700 or 800 the first day , the second day they told they were all presold several times.

So when that AD finally gets it 5 pieces they can do whatever they want with them. And I guess they modified their 5 pieces.

I think Zenith had a 400 or 450 of these calibers
Some of them were probably broken or unusable and these were used to make 300 or 400 good calibers
250 in titanium and 75 in gold ( 325 in total)

I hope they still have one left
You know, every year there is a special auction. Charity auction called 'only watch' several brand (zenith included) do make 1 very unique watch and the entire amount goes to charity. The watches are sold via antiquorum.
I really hope Zenith offers this year a unique type 20. Why not 1 in platinum.

Doing so this watch will even get more succes and become more collectible

My AD ordered my Aeronef at Basel last Spring, and was told because of the demand they weren't able to guarantee them the one, but another AD is able to secure 5 Aeronef's at Basel? Sorry but that seems very unlikely.

What is your reference for the 400/450 calibres? I have been researching this watch since Zenith announced it last year and have been unable to find where Zenith stated the number of vintage calibres they actually have... This number would alay my fears.

[ducatidoc]

The release/preorder of the titaniums at SIHH was a major debacle for dealers, at least here in the states.
I' m reasonably certain they (Zenith) didn't have any notion of how enthusiastic the response would be.

As for the 5 dlc-coated versions, I think Bruno has nailed it, ie, they were customized for one boutique - a major mistake, imo. Also, keep in mind that US dealers are not their highest priority sales, so I can easily see a European boutique having a more preferred position.

I was one of the disappointed ones who could not get a titanium version, but with #4 of the RG series, I am not complaining.

Boy, do all of my 46 mm watches cases look puny now.

[unknown]

Originally Posted by MoosicPa

My AD ordered my Aeronef at Basel last Spring, and was told because of the demand they weren't able to guarantee them the one, but another AD is able to secure 5 Aeronef's at Basel? Sorry but that seems very unlikely.

What is your reference for the 400/450 calibres? I have been researching this watch since Zenith announced it last year and have been unable to find where Zenith stated the number of vintage calibres they actually have... This number would alay my fears.

Like ducatidoc said, the US is not the best markt for Zenith.
Europa was always a good market for Zenith. Especially France and Italy so I'm sure European dealers can get more pieces.
I was told 20 of these went to France, that's almost 10% of the total production.

About these 5 pieces .... man this is a VERY big dealer in Monaco
I'm sure you know Monaco :-) If there is one place in the world where you'll find ALL the richest people in the world ... it must be Monaco
So i'm not at all surprised that this specific dealer gets 5 pieces. I bet that dealer sells more Zenith tourbillons in one year than all US Zenith dealers together

[unknown]

Originally Posted by ducatidoc

The release/preorder of the titaniums at SIHH was a major debacle for dealers, at least here in the states.
I' m reasonably certain they (Zenith) didn't have any notion of how enthusiastic the response would be.

As for the 5 dlc-coated versions, I think Bruno has nailed it, ie, they were customized for one boutique - a major mistake, imo. Also, keep in mind that US dealers are not their highest priority sales, so I can easily see a European boutique having a more preferred position.

I was one of the disappointed ones who could not get a titanium version, but with #4 of the RG series, I am not complaining.

Boy, do all of my 46 mm watches cases look puny now.

can you share pics ? Never seen many pics of this watch

What do you think about the whole new TYPE 20 Pilot line ? The 48 mm pieces ?

I LOVE THEM !

[ducatidoc]

I like the new ones, with the EP movements. The Elite models look nice too, but I don't think they will sell as readily. My AD has the annual calendar version reserved in both styles, but I may need to pass unless I happen to be flush with cash when they get here. I would go for the RG- bezel version, which could be in the daily rotation, as opposed to the 57mm, which only comes out occasionally, for obvious reasons.

I am a little disappointed that they call the smaller models by the same name "Montre D'aeronef Type 20"
That should be reserved for the original ltd edition 57mm to avoid confusion.

[unknown]

Originally Posted by ducatidoc

I am a little disappointed that they call the smaller models by the same name "Montre D'aeronef Type 20"
That should be reserved for the original ltd edition 57mm to avoid confusion.

I see it differently
I think it's good they made these smaller ones and I have no problem with the fact that they use the same name.

If they would not hav emade these ... the big one 57.5 would be forgotten too soon. Only 250 + 75 of them makes them a micro edition

Now, putting the 48mm in the catalog for the next years will make this type of watch popular and recognizable .... but the one with the 5011 calibre will always be the first and the original.

[ducatidoc]

Here's the only photo I got with a decent camera so far.

[paverman]

Wow that's a big watch.

[ducatidoc]

Bruno, Don and I all have one. I bet they will agree, it's a great watch to wear. I hate taking it off, but I would never wear it while working. Too much chance it will get banged up. One thing for sure, it's easy on middle-aged (read: poor) eyesight.

[unknown]

Originally Posted by ducatidoc

Bruno, Don and I all have one. I bet they will agree, it's a great watch to wear. I hate taking it off, but I would never wear it while working. Too much chance it will get banged up. One thing for sure, it's easy on middle-aged (read: poor) eyesight.

I hate taking it of too and that's something I did not expect.
I always thought ; Buy it , it's unique and if you can get one don't doubt
take your chance

But before I got it I thought I would be happy if I could wear it ... IF I would have the guts

The day it arrived I put it on my wrist and it stayed there for 8 weeks.
8 weeks must be a record, I have more than 1 watch and I don't think I have one watchthat I wore more than 4 weeks in a row.µ8 weeks for the TYPE 20 than I convinced myself to take another one

And what surprised my the most are some reactions I got. I thought that reactions would be negative because of it's size.

Well, very strange but somehow everybody that said something about it seemed to like the watch. And some of them were from good friends. Friends who are not into watches but friend sI know well enought to know they would tell me the truth. If they would not like it they would say it

[unknown]

Originally Posted by ducatidoc

Here's the only photo I got with a decent camera so far.

that is really nice !

[MoosicPa]

Originally Posted by ducatidoc

Here's the only photo I got with a decent camera so far.

That is nice, I haven't seen a gold version in person yet, but it is a sweet watch. It would look really awesome with a black band!

[MoosicPa]

I have discovered that the 5 piece dock edition bears a different reference number than the original titanium edition. The titanium L.E. is ref. no. 95-2420-5011 and the dlc edition is ref. no. 75-2420-5011. I'm still of the opinion that these are not part of the original 250 piece L.E., but an additional 5 pieces.

[ducatidoc]

Originally Posted by MoosicPa

That is nice, I haven't seen a gold version in person yet, but it is a sweet watch. It would look really awesome with a black band!

I originally thought the same thing when I ordered it, and in fact made an inquiry to the AD, who is researching. I'm wondering if the straps from the new series are the same width, because they are clearly showing a black alligator strap. That being said, I am sort of sweet on the brown strap, now that I have it. It gives it a sporty-casual vibe to contrast the gold bling factor.

[unknown]

Originally Posted by MoosicPa

I have discovered that the 5 piece dock edition bears a different reference number than the original titanium edition. The titanium L.E. is ref. no. 95-2420-5011 and the dlc edition is ref. no. 75-2420-5011. I'm still of the opinion that these are not part of the original 250 piece L.E., but an additional 5 pieces.

why not send a mail to this specific dealer and ask if he got a few titanium ans 5 extra in DLC, or only the DLC ?