The problem isn’t with Rolex, it is with their ADs.

[njlam]

While I understand why ADs use the most sought-after Rolex models as incentives for customers to buy non-Rolex watches and high-margin jewelry, I don’t understand why Rolex allows it.

We all know once you own one Rolex, you will want to own more. Why then, are allocations made to maximize non-Rolex profits of the ADs, rather than maximize the number of Rolex owners?

Everyone knows Rolex sells every watch it makes (so why care what anyone thinks), however the current state of the AD experience is so unpleasant, it is damaging their long-term reputation. Perhaps a change is afoot as we are seeing many independent AD lose the privilege of carrying Rolex. There is likely more to go before it is over.

In my opinion, the current AD model is broken at best, corrupt at worst. And while I make room for the idea that some people have AD/SAs that they like personally (hate the game, not the playa…), but my question is this: if certain Rolex models are so hard to get, why are there so many available at grey market dealers?

The large number of BNIB sought-after models (with current year warranty card) that are available at Trusted Sellers/Chrono24/eBay suggests two things:
1. ADs are doing a poor job of identifying flippers (or are sharing the profits with flippers)
2. AD are complicit (profit sharing) with grey dealers

A good example of #2 is: some greys are currently offering new PM models below MSRP. How is this possible if an AD is not complicit? Obviously it is a bad look for an AD to give a discount to a retail customer; but if an AD can lighten their less sought-after inventory to a grey and still make a little that is good business (for them).

Once the move to Rolex-only boutiques and Rolex-owned chains (ie Bucherer) becomes more the norm, hopefully the allocation process becomes less focused on maximizing non-Rolex profits at non-Rolex owned ADs. When “Rolex-First” becomes the priority, perhaps allocations will become more accessible to more watch enthusiasts.

[racerx]

Rolex is like an auto maker, they sell their product(s) to a retailer and then warranty them. Sort of like how a high-line Cadillac Escalade is sold over MSRP, and the dealers can’t get enough of them.

[24hr]

The problem isn’t with Rolex, it is with their ADs

The “problem” with Rolex are the customers.

[Kevin of Larchmont]

Originally Posted by njlam

Everyone knows Rolex sells every watch it makes (so why care what anyone thinks), however the current state of the AD experience is so unpleasant, it is damaging their long-term reputation.

I’ve read so many different versions of this exact same sentiment here over so many years and what is the manifestation of Rolex’s so-called damaged long-term reputation when the consensus here is also that they still sell every watch they make?

[Harry-57]

There is nothing wrong with my Rolex AD so far as my experience with them goes. Someone else may regard my AD differently. One cannot generalise or project because there is a lot of variability between ADs and each of their customers.

Businesses can and will do business with other businesses. It's allowed. It's how the secondary market gets a proportion of its inventory across all the brands it trades. For a few models from a very few brands, if customers are willing to pay a premium this model will work for all concerned in the chain. If you think it's unfair, I would be more inclined to blame those who are willing to pump money in by buying pre owned hot models over MSRP from non ADs. The pre owned market has existed for longer than I have. It's usually tilted in favour of discounts. Rolex is a bit different at present. It's a glitch. It may never resolve (unlikely) but it isn't a reason to take a wrecking ball to it.

In the UK the AD owns their stock. They can do what they like with their stock within limits laid down by Rolex, who police their ADs using a number of direct and indirect methods - so my AD tells me. From what you say it sounds like it's more of an unregulated free for all in the US. It ain't broke here, at least for me, so I wouldn't want to fix it.

[soxfan39]

Seems pretty straightforward to me what's going on. AD's bundling slow moving pieces along with hot sellers to Grey's. Grey's get the hot pieces that sell for over MSRP and then sell the slow moving stuff under retail. AD gets to move lots more inventory thereby maximizing profit.

[njlam]

Originally Posted by Kevin of Larchmont

I’ve read so many different versions of this exact same sentiment here over so many years and what is the manifestation of Rolex’s so-called damaged long-term reputation when the consensus here is also that they still sell every watch they make?

I've read so many times how you get all the Rolexes you want and how much your AD loves you. Good for you and I hope that situation lasts.

There are some of us who are less fortunate and have to make due with our sorry lot in our watch lives.

The fact that they sell everything they make is the point. Why do they facilitate independent AD's profit by helping them selling more non-Rolex products at the expense of the brand?

FWIW I bought 10 watches last year with only two being Rolexes, 1 preowned, 1 grey. None of the other eight impacted my spend history with a Rolex AD.

While I would have like to buy more Rolexes, no AD offered the models I wanted, so I bought other brands (Omega/JLC/Zenith/Grand Seiko/Panerai/Baltic/Swatch). I guess in some ways, the unattainability of Rolexes helps the entire watch industry.

At this point, I find it humiliating to go into an AD, knowing they receive dozens of watches a month, yet choose not to sell me one. I wonder if others feel similarly?

Of course people will tell me to go grey, (and I have for three of the four Rolex’s I own), but this rant is just about a process than can/should be better, but isn’t.

Again, I think ultimately Rolex can’t be happy about the manner their watches are distributed. The Bucherer acquisition and the closing of independent ADs are a step in the right direction.

Question for Kevin: If your AD lost their Rolex relationship and you had to start from scratch with someone new, would you feel the same as you do now?

[Harry-57]

Originally Posted by soxfan39

AD gets to move lots more inventory thereby maximizing profit.

... and in some cases uses this to help keep its franchise. Maybe not so much on Rolex, but businesses don't stay afloat by doing nothing.

[Andad]

Most are aware of the issues.

What is the answer?

[askdanny]

Rolex doesn't have a production problem.

It has a distribution problem.

--Danny

[Kevin of Larchmont]

Originally Posted by njlam

I've read so many times how you get all the Rolexes you want and how much your AD loves you. Good for you and I hope that situation lasts.

There are some of us who are less fortunate and have to make due with our sorry lot in our watch lives.

The fact that they sell everything they make is the point. Why do they facilitate independent AD's profit by helping them selling more non-Rolex products at the expense of the brand?

FWIW I bought 10 watches last year with only two being Rolexes, 1 preowned, 1 grey. None of the other eight impacted my spend history with a Rolex AD.

While I would have like to buy more Rolexes, no AD offered the models I wanted, so I bought other brands (Omega/JLC/Zenith/Grand Seiko/Panerai/Baltic/Swatch). I guess in some ways, the unattainability of Rolexes helps the entire watch industry.

At this point, I find it humiliating to go into an AD, knowing they receive dozens of watches a month, yet choose not to sell me one. I wonder if others feel similarly?

Of course people will tell me to go grey, (and I have for three of the four Rolex’s I own), but this rant is just about a process than can/should be better, but isn’t.

Again, I think ultimately Rolex can’t be happy about the manner their watches are distributed. The Bucherer acquisition and the closing of independent ADs are a step in the right direction.

Question for Kevin: If your AD lost their Rolex relationship, would you feel the same as you do now?

I’m still waiting for you to answer my question, what is the manifestation of Rolex’s so-called years-long damaged long-term reputation? I appreciate your experience and your feelings about it but how has this “damaged reputation” harmed Rolex in all the years that it’s been proclaimed here?

And if my preferred AD lost their Rolex relationship they would still buy and sell interesting pre-owned watches and I would still buy from them because I like the store and the people who work there.

[Kingcobb]

The ADs are able to use rarer watches to get people to buy less desirable watches because they cut production to artificially create a shortage and increase demand. So the ADs are doing exactly what Rolex wants them to dom

[njlam]

Originally Posted by Kevin of Larchmont

I’m still waiting for you to answer my question, what is the manifestation of Rolex’s so-called years-long damaged long-term reputation? I appreciate your experience and your feelings about it but how has this “damaged reputation” harmed Rolex in all the years that it’s been proclaimed here?

I've answered your question and I think you choose not to acknowledge it. People have money budgeted for watches, and with Rolex's unattainability, a larger percentage of that budget goes to other watch manufacturers. In addition to this lost market share, the resentment and overall bad feelings engendered are not corporate assets, they are liabilities. Your blind love for the brand may not allow you to see this.

You have also not answered any of the questions I have posed:

1. Why does Rolex facilitate independent ADs using their product to sell non-Rolex products? If Rolex products sell themselves (and they sell everything they make), why do they want/need to do this? The AD seems more like an unnecessary step in the distribution process.

2. If ADs are so honest, how come so many recently sold Rolex watches are available on the grey market? Are flippers so hard to identify?

Regardless of your answers, in my case, the AD experience has made the universe of Rolex watches I want smaller rather than larger. The hassle is just not worth it; this is because I love watches, not just Rolexes. I suspect your watch interests may be more narrow than mine.

While there are a few more Rolexes I would like to own, I am not sitting by the phone. FWIW, I just ordered a Laine, who is an independent watchmaker based in Switzerland (annual production ~200 pieces with only two models offered) who told me my watch should be ready in July…the reason for the wait is because all Torsti Laine’s watches are made to order…It is nice to work directly with the watchmaker with no ADs involved.

Its possible your tolerance for AD BS is just higher than mine...

[KathleenL]

Originally Posted by njlam

We all know once you own one Rolex, you will want to own more.

Nope. I own one Rolex and have no desire for another.

[kopi-c]

AD are not really the problem per se.

If Rolex HQ could/wanted to end the flipper and resale/grey dealer /scalpers they can but will not.

An example might be that a new watch warranty are non transferable and register only one name/owner at point of sale.

[Fleetlord]

Rolex doesn't have any "problems"

Their dominance in the luxury watch market is absolute.

Their marketing strategy has made them arguably the strongest brand name of any product in the world.

I guess, if I were to personally dig deeper for a "problem", I feel they still have too many inadequate dealers in terms of quality of merchandising build out and location.

Rolex is actively addressing that, so they see an issue there and are cutting doors to resolve effectively.

[JC316]

[agriculture&watches]

Originally Posted by askdanny

Rolex doesn't have a production problem.

It has a distribution problem.

--Danny

Agree with your statement

[KatGirl]

Nothing wrong with my AD. I’ve gotten the watches I want with little trouble, and no real spend history worth mentioning. As in the UK, the ADs in the US own their inventory. They can sell to whomever they want. I do know that Rolex does not like, nor do they encourage ADs to require spend histories in order to secure an allocation. I am treated very well at my AD, so no complaints from me.

Kat


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[996marty]

Originally Posted by Fleetlord

Rolex doesn't have any "problems"

Their dominance in the luxury watch market is absolute.

Their marketing strategy has made them arguably the strongest brand name of any product in the world.

I guess, if I were to personally dig deeper for a "problem", I feel they still have too many inadequate dealers in terms of quality of merchandising build out and location.

Rolex is actively addressing that, so they see an issue there and are cutting doors to resolve effectively.

This is just about spot on

[sgt10p]

With a product so high in demand it's human nature that's the problem. It's not just Rolex, it's everything. At least this is just a luxury item.

[kieselguhr]

Originally Posted by Fleetlord

I guess, if I were to personally dig deeper for a "problem", I feel they still have too many inadequate dealers in terms of quality of merchandising build out and location.

Rolex is actively addressing that, so they see an issue there and are cutting doors to resolve effectively.

Definitely. All the traditional ADs with a Rolex section in town are gone (including my long time AD). All that is left are boutiques that only sell Rolex products.

The current Rolex boutique I patronize has been just as honest as my former AD setting reasonable expectations and I have gotten hard to get models within reasonable wait, without having to buy anything else

The resentment towards Rolex, their ADs, preowned sellers, the entire supply chain etc typically have the same flavor. Maybe the real question should be introspective.

[Madman37]

Why are you so mad about not being able to get a rolex as many have said its "just a mass produced item" even though still nobody cant tell me how many daytonas steel white , black, BLNRs are produced in the 1million plus watches rolex sells per year.

The whole point of a luxury item is its hard to get its what drives its desirability. Would you be really want it so bad if it was on the shelf ready to buy?

I personally think rolex produce to many watches and should cut production by half and make it even more hard to get but what do i know. They seem to know what they are doing.

Also with watch prices going down and the new generation probably walking away from items like manual watches you may eventually be able to get everything you want at a discount soon.

[ratty]

Originally Posted by njlam

FWIW I bought 10 watches last year with only two being Rolexes, 1 preowned, 1 grey.

…

What’s the difference?

[joli160]

The moment each model becomes instantly available at an AD nobody will buy them anymore and the brand value goes down the drain.

Low supply and encouraging the ‘grey’ market keeps Rolex being sought after and that is what Rolex is doing. Good business

[neverenoughtime]

Originally Posted by joli160

The moment each model becomes instantly available at an AD nobody will buy them anymore and the brand value goes down the drain.

Low supply and encouraging the ‘grey’ market keeps Rolex being sought after and that is what Rolex is doing. Good business

Nobody wants to admit it, but this is 100% accurate.

We all want what we can’t have.

[padi56]

Originally Posted by 24hr

The problem isn’t with Rolex, it is with their ADs

The “problem” with Rolex are the customers.

Have to agree if all prospective buyers stopped all tis so called AD building relationship stuff, and refused to play these so called AD games then perhaps we could get back to normally.

[DLRIDES]

Originally Posted by 24hr

The problem isn’t with Rolex, it is with their ADs

The “problem” with Rolex are the customers.

/\ THIS /\

The AD will do as a customer allows !

Examples of such are posted daily on this forum.

“How much do I spend to be favored by the AD” is a common theme. These individuals could be described with an array of tasteless adjectives that would result in being banned.

[Devildog]

Originally Posted by njlam

People have money budgeted for watches, and with Rolex's unattainability, a larger percentage of that budget goes to other watch manufacturers. In addition to this lost market share, the resentment and overall bad feelings engendered are not corporate assets, they are liabilities. Your blind love for the brand may not allow you to see this.
.

If Rolex sells every watch it makes market share and resentment are irrelevant.

The resentment as you put it only exists amongs forums such as this, and people such as yourself.

Can I ger any Rolex I want from an AD? No. Not a chance.

Do I care? No. Not at all. Its just a watch.

99.99% of the worlds population who have any interest in watches or status will still aspire to own a Rolex.

There is no material damage.

If you carry resentment for a brand becasue you cannot buy one of theor products from an authorised retailer the problem is with you, not with the brand.

[Andad]

Originally Posted by Devildog

If Rolex sells every watch it makes market share and resentment are irrelevant.

The resentment as you put it only exists amongs forums such as this, and people such as yourself.

Can I get any Rolex I want from an AD? No. Not a chance.

Do I care? No. Not at all. Its just a watch.

99.99% of the worlds population who have any interest in watches or status will still aspire to own a Rolex.

There is no material damage.

If you carry resentment for a brand because you cannot buy one of their products from an authorised retailer the problem is with you, not with the brand.

11/10.