Autheticating Rolex help

[iiinycboi]

Hello everyone!

I am new to these forums and i was recently pass down a vintage watch from my father. Ever since then i started to develop a taste for collecting watches and want to know more about them!

Anyways, i recently acquired a 1655 Explorer II with the orange hand aka steve mcqueen(without papers and box) I have started reading up on the watch and the 3 different generations of the watch. I started comparing the watch to pictures i found in these forums and i noticed some strange inconsistencies with the dial and band.

The dial says T swiss T on the bottom which i believe is the original dial for the watch. The second hand is the luminous dot which i believe makes the watch the second generations of the 1655 series.

Now when comparing with the pictures online i started to noticed that the crown logo is the first generation crown with the smallest oval hole. I believe 1655 dials uses the 2nd version of the crown logos? And it also has no spacing in between the crown logo and the triangle on top (where the number 12 should be)

The T Swiss T does not line up with the lines that are shown on other people's watches.

Also i quickly checked the band and noticed the head links are 593 when the 1655 second generation comes with 580 bands. There are also no reference on the band.

Is there other things i should be looking at to try and authenticate Rolex watches? I believe if you open the watch there should be 2 purple gears if it is an authentic Rolex.

Can someone give me some pointers in spotting fakes and authenticating Rolex watches?

Sorry for the long first post! Thank you and any help is very appreciated!

[Lol-x]

Photographs would be useful

[iiinycboi]

Here are the pics of the inconsistencies i've noticed, if you guys need more pics i can take some more of the required parts to help authenticate. THANKS!

[Andad]

I'd wear it.

[mcjp6]

Originally Posted by directioneng

I'd wear it.

Me too.....

[iiinycboi]

good to know! so nothing i should be worried about? any tips on winding and changing dates? i hear turning counter clockwise damage movements? also to always make the clock go froward in time and never backwards?? thanks!!

[iiinycboi]

also can someone please tell me what do you look at/for to try to tell if its real? i have no knowledge of what i should be looking at except comparing photos. (and mine doesnt really match alot of the members pics in this forum =( )

[pablofields]

Originally Posted by iiinycboi

also can someone please tell me what do you look at/for to try to tell if its real? i have no knowledge of what i should be looking at except comparing photos. (and mine doesnt really match alot of the members pics in this forum =( )

I hate to be the fly in the ointment but I think there is an issue with the dial. I've never seen a legit 1655 dial with that combination of modern "rounded" coronet with the "T Swiss T" markings at the bottom of the dial. Also, the "T" on the right side looks too close to the minute marker, and look at the space between the "Y" and "S" in "Oyster"--I don't see a similar space in any of the reference examples below.

Also the bezel markings don't appear to match the references either.

http://stefanomazzariol.blogspot.com...22freccione%22

I hope some of the experts can take a look and give their views. And that if this isn't legit, you have recourse. Best of luck!

Here from Stefano Mazzariol's web site is an identification of the dials and marking combinations, and bezels.

[Andad]

I'd still wear it.

Looks good to me.

Do you have the s/n?

[blackmsport]

i wear it too

[Rolex116520]

Start with having a look at how the hands are stacked .

[mcjp6]

Originally Posted by Rolex116520

Start with having a look at how the hands are stacked .

I've been wrong before, but the hand stack looks OK to me...

iiinycboi is there any reason to think the dial may have been refinished?

[Andad]

The hand stack is very clear in the first pix.

[Rolex116520]

This model watch should have a 1570 /1575 mov.
Correct me if mistaken but I believe the correct sequence from dial towards glass would be : standard hour hand / GMT hand / minute hand / seconds hand .
The second picture is clear .

[stevemulholland3]

sorry guys but theres some major issues with that watch..

[Rolex116520]

Crownguards look a tad off size to me .

[TimeToGo]

I would not argue with our experts on this model, "PabloFields" or Steve M!

[iiinycboi]

Originally Posted by mcjp6

I've been wrong before, but the hand stack looks OK to me...

iiinycboi is there any reason to think the dial may have been refinished?

Hey, i think its 24hr hand, hr hand, minute hand, then second hand. i am not sure if the watch has been refinished, but the band has been changed and my father has said it was very clean inside? also he is not the first owner he acquired it by a friend who had some debt and sold it to my father to pay for cash. They went to a watch dealer to verify it was real before giving the money. (but who knows maybe the watch dealer didnt know his stuff)

Originally Posted by directioneng

I'd still wear it.

Looks good to me.

Do you have the s/n?

i will open up the back and take some pictures of the movement and post s/n. althought im not sure if its safe to post s/n here? i seen members block out 3 numbers of the s/n?

Originally Posted by stevemulholland3

sorry guys but theres some major issues with that watch..

Hey Steve, could you help me verify/authentic this watch. i can post more pics of whatever you request and check whatever you need to. i just want to find out if this is a legit watch. the first thing i noticed was the crown and the "T swiss T" being off.

Thanks guys for the quick responses! i am opening it up right now! just have no experience some i'm reading up on how to open it without damaging it.

also thank you pablo for the ref images!

[iiinycboi]

Oh also when i change the time/date the second hand doesnt stop moving. i read that they should stop when im adjusting the time?

[Rolex116520]

Originally Posted by iiinycboi

Oh also when i change the time/date the second hand doesnt stop moving. i read that they should stop when im adjusting the time?

1575 is a hacking movement .
It would be interesting to see what is fitted and what and how is written between the lugs .
You can of course blot out the last 3 digits . If anything it would be the first 4 of any relevance .

[iiinycboi]

ok so turns out i dont have enough watchmaker tools to open up the back, im going to find a watch shop to open it up for me and ill take some pictures asap.

[TimeToGo]

Originally Posted by iiinycboi

ok so turns out i dont have enough watchmaker tools to open up the back, im going to find a watch shop to open it up for me and ill take some pictures asap.

Do you have a pair of pliers?

[iiinycboi]

Hello everyone. I got some pictures of the insides and outside of the watch. Please help me find out whats going on with the watch. Thanks!

Here is the band and head links. The band has no ref # and the head links are 593. How would you authenticate a Rolex band?
http://i.imgur.com/UiZrE.jpg head link and pin
http://i.imgur.com/cZJCR.jpg band 1
http://i.imgur.com/MKQRn.jpg band 2
http://i.imgur.com/Zbvkn.jpg band 3

Here is the picture of the crown with some clearance.
http://i.imgur.com/Noogr.jpg crown 1
http://i.imgur.com/5LNa9.jpg crown 2

After taking the bands of here whats on the side of the case.

Stainless Steel
4320XXX
http://i.imgur.com/fOTEW.jpg
Registered Design
1655
http://i.imgur.com/rMJ4q.jpg

The movement from what i can make out of the stamp is 1570 and has the red/purple gears. and has the S/N 9062XXX on the movement.

http://i.imgur.com/JImhb.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/Y1Xoh.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/61Lr2.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/iBzcj.jpg

The back of the case is stamped with

Montres Rolex S.A.
Geneva
Swtizerland
Patented

Stainless Steel


1655

http://i.imgur.com/4IEpS.jpg


I can take some additional pictures if needed. So i'm speculating that the dial is fake and the movement is real? As far as my e-knowledge of this watch goes. Hopefully you guys can educate me some more.

Thanks for helping!!!

[mcjp6]

Looking at those case markings, it looks like there are long "E"s (and other bad fonts), which unfortunately would mean the case is also fake.

[pablofields]

Originally Posted by mcjp6

Looking at those case markings, it looks like there are long "E"s (and other bad fonts), which unfortunately would mean the case is also fake.

Unfortunately, I think you're right. Again for reference (from Stefano Mazzariol's blog), these are the known correct marking versions. All have the "short" middle "E" stroke:

[iiinycboi]

What a shame, i guess it is a fake. I thought i noticed something off when i first compared it. Cant believe they can make watches so similar now without reference you wouldn't even be able to pick up on it.

Anyone can chime in on the movement?

[pablofields]

Originally Posted by iiinycboi

What a shame, i guess it is a fake. I thought i noticed something off when i first compared it. Cant believe they can make watches so similar now without reference you wouldn't even be able to pick up on it.

Anyone can chime in on the movement?

Can you share with the Forum from whom you acquired the watch? Might help others from suffering similar misfortune.

[tudorman8276]

[iiinycboi]

Originally Posted by pablofields

Can you share with the Forum from whom you acquired the watch? Might help others from suffering similar misfortune.

Hi, it was given to me by my father. He acquired when one of his friend's friend owe some people some money and asked my father to buy it for a under 2000 dollars. My father went to a watch shop with the guy and they said it was a real rolex and my father gave him the money for it. When my father came back home then he realized it was a very expensive watch and worth a lot of money. But never really checked or got it certified to be real. He just thought he found a really good deal on a watch that turned out to be worth a lot of money. He has never wore it he just kept it in a box and that was it.

Then he gave it to me and i just decided to start reading up on it.

Thanks for all the help guys! Now that i know its a fake, i can probably just wear it and not really care about what happens to it.

Also to clarify is the movement fake as well? Probably wouldnt tell my dad since it would probably upset him.

[mcjp6]

Originally Posted by iiinycboi

Also to clarify is the movement fake as well? Probably wouldnt tell my dad since it would probably upset him.

Such a shame...

I am not a 100% but my guess is that the movement is OK. A lot of these scams with fake/refinished dials and fake cases do have genuine movements. If so it could be worth up to $1200-1400 imo.