ROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEX

GatorSox · 31 January 2020, 03:40 AM

Is there a rule of thumb on how much of a discount there should be on a modern watch (say a Hulk or Kermit), from a trusted seller, without box and card/papers? Or would you avoid these in most cases?

I am planning on keeping the watch long term, but I also never know when my collecting preferences can change, and may need to trade/sell something.

Rori · 31 January 2020, 03:42 AM

I would never buy a watch without papers. Box has no importance to me.

enjoythemusic · 31 January 2020, 03:54 AM

Modern should have B&P. Like Rori, I'd walk.

dba · 31 January 2020, 03:58 AM

I wouldn't be too wary if it was from a trusted seller. With all of their references, it should be fine. You can always get it serviced at a Rolex Service Center. You get their guarantee which will serve as the watch's authenticity if you want to sell it later.

SDREW22 · 31 January 2020, 04:02 AM

Purchasing depends on the seller. You will take a hit selling without box and papers.

2nastie · 31 January 2020, 04:05 AM

On a modern piece there is no added value on a watch that has it's box and papers, but certainly has a bit of negative effect if it doesn't. I would not pay market value for it. I'll at least knock off a few hundred or a thousand bucks on it.

But personally, there are so many modern examples out there that are equal or greater condition. I would buy that particular example when you could easily find something with the full kit.

Yes... box and papers are useless anyways... but on a modern piece its considered part of a set. I like things complete unless its vintage.

Wrist-->Rolex · 31 January 2020, 04:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rori

I would never buy a watch without papers. Box has no importance to me.

I feel this way as well

Rori · 31 January 2020, 04:36 AM

I won't do it not for resell devaluation but mainly for piece of mind. With today's horror stories about perfect fakes I won't take a risk even if it's a trusted seller unless the watch is authenticated at an RSC by the seller or i am allowed to do so before buying it.

42itus · 31 January 2020, 05:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rori

I won't do it not for resell devaluation but mainly for piece of mind. With today's horror stories about perfect fakes I won't take a risk even if it's a trusted seller unless the watch is authenticated at an RSC by the seller or i am allowed to do so before buying it.

I agree with you completely but I’ve seen some really good examples of fake cards as well.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

CDNWatchNut · 31 January 2020, 05:12 AM

Recent RSC service documents to me are more valuable than an outdated warranty paper or card.

Rori · 31 January 2020, 05:15 AM

Hahahahaha, I missed that part which is the easiest to make a fake off but at least one can verify the original owner. Also forgot to mention that no box no papers can be a red flag if possible stolen watch.

Quote:

Originally Posted by 42itus

I agree with you completely but I’ve seen some really good examples of fake cards as well.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

joli160 · 31 January 2020, 05:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CDNWatchNut

Recent RSC service documents to me are more valuable than an outdated warranty paper or card.

Market dictates otherwise, personally without the original papers I'd never buy one.

Rado63 · 31 January 2020, 05:42 AM

These two watches are always an issue. A Hulk and a Kermit. For me if I am the buyer, I need lots of authentication. Search the forum for real versus fake hulk or kermit and see what has been written. Used to be lot's of guys on here with great eyes, could spot fakes, and give the details of why it's fake. so look at some old threads. But to answer your question, if the watch has truly been authenticated by Rolex, keep that piece of documentation to prove it's authenticity, don't need box and papers. In the modern age everyone thinks all watches should have box and papers.

RJRJRJ · 31 January 2020, 05:46 AM

My only worry would be that it could be stolen. Otherwise I'd pay maybe $1000 less and send it to RSC for a service and paperwork. This assumes you bought it from a trusted seller that would take care of you if there were any issues.

Tools · 31 January 2020, 05:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GatorSox

Is there a rule of thumb on how much of a discount there should be on a modern watch (say a Hulk or Kermit), from a trusted seller, without box and card/papers? Or would you avoid these in most cases?
….

The rule of thumb on the green Sub Date is to not buy without papers that show it originally came as a green model.

Otherwise, value is the same as the black one.

enjoythemusic · 31 January 2020, 06:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rori

...no box no papers can be a red flag if possible stolen watch.

Ahh yes, that too. Lots of theft, sadly, happenes in many parts of the world.

timeldn · 31 January 2020, 06:19 AM

I would purchase with papers the box is not difficult to acquire. If the watch is authentic I would still be concerned if it might have been stolen. You could get it authenticated.
If you wish to sell the watch in the future, you would take a hit on the price. Good luck.

MasonDixon · 31 January 2020, 06:22 AM

If it's a Hulk that should still be under warranty, then no papers = no buy for me.

Wedders · 31 January 2020, 06:29 AM

Personally I prefer box and papers but not essential. I think a bracelet should also be included to be called a full set even though I’m not keen on wearing them. Most of my bracelets are in the cupboard with their box and papers.

daOnlyBG · 31 January 2020, 06:32 AM

I've bought a hulk with no box or papers.

If the price is right, anything goes. And boy was that watch's price right.

subtona · 31 January 2020, 06:45 AM

If it means something to you, then you have to decide what the value is.

Caveat is that if no box and no papers are included and the source is not known to you, then there is a potential that the watch did not find its way intentionally to the for-sale market by the original owner.

42itus · 31 January 2020, 06:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rori

Hahahahaha, I missed that part which is the easiest to make a fake off but at least one can verify the original owner. Also forgot to mention that no box no papers can be a red flag if possible stolen watch.

Absolutely. Wasn’t trying to dispute anything you said but wanted a newbie to know that a card isn’t a guarantee.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

MARGARITATIME · 31 January 2020, 06:49 AM

I bought my Hulk from a local trusted Jewerly watch dealer. I had two options - 1 with and 1 without papers. I chose no papers for $1000 cheaper. Figured I could use the discount for a free service when needed and get the card and save a couple hundred. Going on a year or so and its 1/sec + after about a week timed off my Gshock. Personally can't believe it's that accurate, but not complaining. Will send it in when it's not keeping time. within spec.

Runfar · 31 January 2020, 06:49 AM

Id start at 300$ less they really are that important because you may not be as much of a trusted seller to the next person

oversteerdawg · 31 January 2020, 06:50 AM

I’m always paranoid that a watch with no box and papers is stolen.

Michael T · 31 January 2020, 06:55 AM

Box, books and papers are must for me, but it is personal preference. First the watch is less apt to be stolen. Second it helps insure that it was born the way it is now. Third is the concept of liquidity, the box, books and papers will attract a wider array of interested buyers.

danyvw · 31 January 2020, 07:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CDNWatchNut

Recent RSC service documents to me are more valuable than an outdated warranty paper or card.

Same here.

Sent from my SM-T720 using Tapatalk

Nikrnic · 31 January 2020, 07:09 AM

A thousand dollars? Whatever it is having a choice I'd go for the full set. It's always going to be worth that much more in value and peace of mind.

Sent from my SM-G970U using Tapatalk

Euge · 31 January 2020, 07:11 AM

Wouldn’t buy a modern watch with no papers........
Unless it comes with an up to date service receipt from the trusted seller or RSC.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

dwjez14 · 31 January 2020, 07:35 AM

No card for a newer watch no buy for me. I plan on passing watches to my kids I want them to have all documentation.

31 January 2020, 03:40 AM	#1
GatorSox "TRF" Member Join Date: Dec 2019 Location: Orlando, FL Posts: 17	No Box and Card? Is there a rule of thumb on how much of a discount there should be on a modern watch (say a Hulk or Kermit), from a trusted seller, without box and card/papers? Or would you avoid these in most cases? I am planning on keeping the watch long term, but I also never know when my collecting preferences can change, and may need to trade/sell something.

31 January 2020, 03:42 AM	#2
Rori "TRF" Member Join Date: Aug 2018 Location: Middle East Watch: Rolex / Tudor Posts: 3,590	I would never buy a watch without papers. Box has no importance to me. __________________ Good watches are made to tell time but some brands are obsessed to tell it in the most beautiful way possible.

31 January 2020, 03:54 AM	#3
enjoythemusic 2024 Pledge Member Join Date: Nov 2012 Real Name: Steven Location: Glocal Posts: 19,736	Modern should have B&P. Like Rori, I'd walk. __________________ __________________ “Life should not be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside in a cloud of smoke, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming 'Wow! What a Ride!'” -- Hunter S. Thompson Sent from my Etch A Sketch using String Theory.

31 January 2020, 03:58 AM	#4
dba 2024 Pledge Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Real Name: David Location: Gardnerville, NV Watch: 16710 Posts: 2,612	I wouldn't be too wary if it was from a trusted seller. With all of their references, it should be fine. You can always get it serviced at a Rolex Service Center. You get their guarantee which will serve as the watch's authenticity if you want to sell it later. __________________ Current: 16710 Previous: 16760 Fat Lady, 16613 Bluesy, 16800, 14060, 16710 Pepsi, 216570 Polar, 116710LN, 16610, 216570 Polar (again), 16713, 216570 Polar (yet again), 16710 Black w/ Pepsi Insert Hope is not a strategy.

31 January 2020, 04:36 AM	#8
Rori "TRF" Member Join Date: Aug 2018 Location: Middle East Watch: Rolex / Tudor Posts: 3,590	I won't do it not for resell devaluation but mainly for piece of mind. With today's horror stories about perfect fakes I won't take a risk even if it's a trusted seller unless the watch is authenticated at an RSC by the seller or i am allowed to do so before buying it. __________________ Good watches are made to tell time but some brands are obsessed to tell it in the most beautiful way possible.

31 January 2020, 04:02 AM	#5
SDREW22 "TRF" Member Join Date: Dec 2018 Location: CNY Watch: TOG Posts: 580	Purchasing depends on the seller. You will take a hit selling without box and papers.

31 January 2020, 04:05 AM	#6
2nastie "TRF" Member Join Date: Nov 2016 Location: YVR Watch: Time Only Posts: 2,332	On a modern piece there is no added value on a watch that has it's box and papers, but certainly has a bit of negative effect if it doesn't. I would not pay market value for it. I'll at least knock off a few hundred or a thousand bucks on it. But personally, there are so many modern examples out there that are equal or greater condition. I would buy that particular example when you could easily find something with the full kit. Yes... box and papers are useless anyways... but on a modern piece its considered part of a set. I like things complete unless its vintage.

31 January 2020, 05:12 AM	#10
CDNWatchNut "TRF" Member Join Date: Apr 2010 Real Name: Juan Location: Sherwood Park, Ab Watch: 114060 Posts: 1,509	Recent RSC service documents to me are more valuable than an outdated warranty paper or card.

31 January 2020, 05:42 AM	#13
Rado63 "TRF" Member Join Date: May 2017 Real Name: Alan Location: Northern, CA Watch: 116334 Posts: 2,215	These two watches are always an issue. A Hulk and a Kermit. For me if I am the buyer, I need lots of authentication. Search the forum for real versus fake hulk or kermit and see what has been written. Used to be lot's of guys on here with great eyes, could spot fakes, and give the details of why it's fake. so look at some old threads. But to answer your question, if the watch has truly been authenticated by Rolex, keep that piece of documentation to prove it's authenticity, don't need box and papers. In the modern age everyone thinks all watches should have box and papers. __________________ Rolex 116334 126600 228235

31 January 2020, 05:46 AM	#14
RJRJRJ "TRF" Member Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: USA Posts: 3,495	My only worry would be that it could be stolen. Otherwise I'd pay maybe $1000 less and send it to RSC for a service and paperwork. This assumes you bought it from a trusted seller that would take care of you if there were any issues.

31 January 2020, 06:19 AM	#17
timeldn "TRF" Member Join Date: Feb 2018 Location: London Posts: 606	I would purchase with papers the box is not difficult to acquire. If the watch is authentic I would still be concerned if it might have been stolen. You could get it authenticated. If you wish to sell the watch in the future, you would take a hit on the price. Good luck.

31 January 2020, 06:22 AM	#18
MasonDixon "TRF" Member Join Date: Nov 2019 Location: USA Posts: 276	If it's a Hulk that should still be under warranty, then no papers = no buy for me.

31 January 2020, 06:29 AM	#19
Wedders "TRF" Member Join Date: Jun 2017 Location: Somewhere in U.K. Posts: 507	Personally I prefer box and papers but not essential. I think a bracelet should also be included to be called a full set even though I’m not keen on wearing them. Most of my bracelets are in the cupboard with their box and papers.

31 January 2020, 06:32 AM	#20
daOnlyBG "TRF" Member Join Date: Jun 2017 Location: Odorious Onion Watch: yes, it's hipster Posts: 1,572	I've bought a hulk with no box or papers. If the price is right, anything goes. And boy was that watch's price right. __________________ Here come dat boi Jerry

31 January 2020, 06:45 AM	#21
subtona "TRF" Member Join Date: Jan 2011 Real Name: gus Location: East Coast Watch: APK & sometimes Y Posts: 26,054	If it means something to you, then you have to decide what the value is. Caveat is that if no box and no papers are included and the source is not known to you, then there is a potential that the watch did not find its way intentionally to the for-sale market by the original owner. __________________

31 January 2020, 06:49 AM	#23
MARGARITATIME "TRF" Member Join Date: Dec 2014 Location: Ft. Lauderdale Watch: 116610lv, 116710BL Posts: 279	I bought my Hulk from a local trusted Jewerly watch dealer. I had two options - 1 with and 1 without papers. I chose no papers for $1000 cheaper. Figured I could use the discount for a free service when needed and get the card and save a couple hundred. Going on a year or so and its 1/sec + after about a week timed off my Gshock. Personally can't believe it's that accurate, but not complaining. Will send it in when it's not keeping time. within spec.

31 January 2020, 06:49 AM	#24
Runfar "TRF" Member Join Date: Jul 2015 Location: Colorado Posts: 337	Id start at 300$ less they really are that important because you may not be as much of a trusted seller to the next person

31 January 2020, 06:50 AM	#25
oversteerdawg "TRF" Member Join Date: May 2015 Location: CA Posts: 25	I’m always paranoid that a watch with no box and papers is stolen.

31 January 2020, 06:55 AM	#26
Michael T 2024 Pledge Member Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Houston Posts: 1,165	Box, books and papers are must for me, but it is personal preference. First the watch is less apt to be stolen. Second it helps insure that it was born the way it is now. Third is the concept of liquidity, the box, books and papers will attract a wider array of interested buyers.

31 January 2020, 07:09 AM	#28
Nikrnic "TRF" Member Join Date: May 2017 Real Name: Louis Nick Ric Location: Michigan, USA Watch: Blnr, Expll, Subs, Posts: 10,161	A thousand dollars? Whatever it is having a choice I'd go for the full set. It's always going to be worth that much more in value and peace of mind. Sent from my SM-G970U using Tapatalk

31 January 2020, 07:11 AM	#29
Euge "TRF" Member Join Date: Dec 2011 Real Name: Eugenio Location: México Watch: All Watches Posts: 2,970	Wouldn’t buy a modern watch with no papers........ Unless it comes with an up to date service receipt from the trusted seller or RSC. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

31 January 2020, 07:35 AM	#30
dwjez14 2024 Pledge Member Join Date: Nov 2018 Real Name: Danny Location: Mansfield , Texas Watch: All of them Posts: 2,380	No card for a newer watch no buy for me. I plan on passing watches to my kids I want them to have all documentation.

Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)