The Curious case of the Fred Rettenmeyer Patek

[jfriedkin]

The watch is a Patek Philippe Ref 2526 with enamel dial. This watch first appears in 2008 at a Christies auction in New York. The caseback of the watch is engraved: To Fred Rettenmeyer with warmest sentiment and appreciation from Jim Napier Feb. 15, 1957. The watch has case #682812 and movement #760879. The dial has no distinguishing marks. It sells with the original clamshell red box and original hang tag. Christies indicated that this watch has never appeared at auction. Christies specifies that the watch is formerly owned by Fred Rettenmeter. This watch sells for $25,000 in 2008.

Fast forward 10 years and in 2018 Christies again has for sale the Fed Rettenmeyer Patek 2526 up for auction, with the SAME caseback inscription. Christies states that the watch is being sold by a private individual, perhaps the previous winner of the auction 10 years earlier. This time no Red Box and no Hang tag. Curious? I know those clamshell boxes are worth $$$$, perhaps the new owner kept the box and sold the watch? There is no mention of the Movement # or the Case #. The watch is definitely on a different strap. The dial looks like the original, no distinguishing marks. The watch sells for $27,500. Comparing both watches they do look like the exact same watch.

Just yesterday we see a Patek Philippe 2526 come to auction at a rather obscure auction house in Sunrise Florida, Hill Auction Gallery. Seems like the typical small auction house that will see the entire estate of an individual. I have never heard of Hill Auction Gallery. Looking through their auction results they do sell a few watches, but nothing like a Christies Watch Auction. The watch up for sale? The Fred Rettenmeyer Patek Phillipe 2526. Is it possible? Is this the same watch we have seen twice before? For some reason the watch LOOKS different. Then I see it. The DIAL. The dial is a Hausmann signed dial. Curious, I look at the other Fred Rettenmeyer 2526 sold at Christies, neither time does the have Hausmann. Could it be that there are more than one Fred Rettenmeyer Patek 2526 with the exact same inscriptions? I doubt it. Someone swapped the dial! Now I am really intrigued. What else has changed on this watch? Hill Auction Gallery does not give the Case # or Movement #, however they do have several photos on their website. Looking at the the hallmarks on the back of the case, it seems that something IS different. This watch has TWO hallmarks on opposing lugs that are perpendicular to the case. When you look at each of the Christies sales there is only one hallmark and it is parallel to the case. So different dial, and different case, but same caseback. The watch is now missing it’s strap and buckle. When I called Hill Auction Gallery for more information, the only thing that they could tell me was it was for an estate. Not much help. Is this an example of a FrankenWatch? Who would do such a thing to a classic?

Oh, BTW the watch sells for $37,500.

Anyone with additional information on the watch? Tell me what you think?

I do have photos if you are interested.





Here is the history of Fred Rettenmeyer – if your interested

Frederick W. Rettenmeyer (June 29, 1891-April 29, 1965) was the former President and Chairman of the Napier Company. The firm was established in 1875 as Whitney and Rice of Attleboro, MA. manufacturing men's watch chains. Over the years the company changed names on several occasions and in 1922 President James H. Napier changed the firm name to Napier Co. It was at one point the largest privately owned jewellery manufacturer in the country. During the 1930s, 40s and 50s Napier jewellery designers followed the high fashion of Europe and the company was known for its quality handmade pieces.

Frederick Rettenmeyer, born in N. Attleboro, MA. was associated with Napier Co. for 58 years. As a young man he received art instruction from a graduate of Yale Art School and attended classes at Hartford Art School and New Britain Teacher's College. He began his company career at the age of 16 working under his father William who was a designer at Napier Co. William a former Tiffany & Co. silversmith encouraged Frederick's interest in design. When his father retired Frederick had established himself as a quality designer and at the age of 21 he was promoted to head of department. Over the next 58 years, he worked in various positions within the firm. He remained committed to innovative jewellery design and in 1953 took a three month tour of Europe with his wife where he visited various manufactures. Rettenmeyer was named president in March 1960 following the death of James Napier on February 8, 1960. Frederick Rettenmeyer remained with the firm until he retired as President on March 24, 1964. He remained Chairman of the Executive Board until his death the following year.

[azizu]

interesting how you followed his case over the years, are you interested in a 2526? ;)

[MCMartiny]

Intriguing. Perhaps the buyer in the second Christies auction was the type of collector that didn't care much for the provenance / first owner inscription and he replaced the Rettenmeyer case back with a non-engraved one. The engraved case back then could have been re-used in the Hill Auction Gallery watch, perhaps to make it more special, perhaps to replace a scratched / damaged case back.

[2nastie]

Perhaps Frederick Rettenmeyer had two 2526? Not uncommon to do so.

As for the inscription was everything matching exactly, text, etc? The recent Paul Newman's Non-Paul Newman Daytona had the same inscription as the original but different text and of course different watch.

I don't know who Frederick Rettenmeyer but in the grand scheme of things, he is not popular in the world so it's not like there was documentation or studies done on what watches he owned.

You might be just simply overthinking it. The only thing that appears to match right now is reference and the similar inscription. No other identical marks or most importantly serial numbers. It could be two different watches.

[watch-guy.com]

Hi jeff
Interesting conundrum

I am not sure if there would be two "fred rettenmeyers" a la Paul Newman

I suspect more nefarious changes have occurred but obviously cannot prove anything

Watches get changed all the time and even though I am not sure the moniker would add much to the value today, a seller may want to try and increase the value of the watch by adding a name to it- although Frederick Rettenmeyer is not the name to choose today

Thanks for all the investigative work

Julian

[jfriedkin]

I am a 2526 owner. Having been chasing this watch for 10 years and finally found one last year (2020). Always looking to upgrade. I remember looking at this watch in 2010. Now the changes to the dial. I'll post a few photos of other changes I found on the Hill sale. Very interesting.

[jfriedkin]

Originally Posted by azizu

interesting how you followed his case over the years, are you interested in a 2526? ;)

Originally Posted by MCMartiny

Intriguing. Perhaps the buyer in the second Christies auction was the type of collector that didn't care much for the provenance / first owner inscription and he replaced the Rettenmeyer case back with a non-engraved one. The engraved case back then could have been re-used in the Hill Auction Gallery watch, perhaps to make it more special, perhaps to replace a scratched / damaged case back.

The biggest problem with replacing the inscribed caseback from another 2526 would be now you have two watches that do not match (movement #:case #) and Patek will not issue an Extract from the archive. I could see swapping a dial...but for 30K++ I would want a matching #'s watch.

[jfriedkin]

Originally Posted by 2nastie

Perhaps Frederick Rettenmeyer had two 2526? Not uncommon to do so.

As for the inscription was everything matching exactly, text, etc? The recent Paul Newman's Non-Paul Newman Daytona had the same inscription as the original but different text and of course different watch.

I don't know who Frederick Rettenmeyer but in the grand scheme of things, he is not popular in the world so it's not like there was documentation or studies done on what watches he owned.

You might be just simply overthinking it. The only thing that appears to match right now is reference and the similar inscription. No other identical marks or most importantly serial numbers. It could be two different watches.

I highly doubt that Jim Napier would give Fred Rettenmeyer TWO exactly inscribed Patek 2526's. First the 2526 was made in VERY few numbers. Less than 600 over a 30 year period.

[jfriedkin]

Here is the watch from the first Christies sale.

[jfriedkin]

Here is the watch from the 2nd Christies sale

[jfriedkin]

The third sale of the "same" watch from the HILL Auction Gallery

[watch-guy.com]

same case back transferred to another case and dial.

Without movement and case numbers , we know nothing but can speculate- I suspect original dial cracked and replaced with new case and dial- case back transferred to make it look like the original "rettenmeyer"

Julian

[2nastie]

Based on the pictures of case back the inscriptions appear to be identical but without matching serial numbers and such (or even interior case back markings), its hard to tell.

The rest of the case, markings, and dial visually are/appear to be different.

Interesting detective work non the less, are you or were you looking to buy this piece? If so my advice is to just pass. If not, the general thing with vintage watches I've came to learn and hear is that it is tough to certify it to the fullest on what is considered original. In fact, some people claim original as in original parts that are suitable for the watch... not necessarily original to that particular watch.

I remember getting into debates/"arguments" with individuals on what originality means. I value originality as what was put into the watch from Patek, Rolex, Omega, etc. and sold to the first owner... versus those who claim originality is parts from that era.

To answer, if it could be two gifts or unlikelihood of two gifts... hey 600 pieces in the span of 30 years might seem little, but its not like there was a huge demand for watches back in the day. It wouldn't shock me that someone received the same watch twice from the same guy. 600 could be a lot considering Patek made only <10 on certain models back in the day.

[77T]

Unless you’re buying it, not really breaking news. But I applaud tracing down the anomalies.

Who have you told about that small, little known estate auctioneer being mixed up in an illegitimate PP? Seems to be a watch posing to be a remarkable watch.


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[watch-guy.com]

I don’t know if it is the pics but the writing on the hill watch seems to have lines to keep letters straight I do not see them on the Christie’s watch

J


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[MILGAUSS88]

Hill gallery did give the case # and movement #, and it still matches up.

Patek Philippe (Swiss). Men's vintage watch with mechanical movement (sn# 760879) housed in an 18K yellow gold case. Case measures 36mm not including crown. Comes with no strap or bracelet. Dial is ivory enamel, with gold indicators. Marked Patek Philippe on dial case and movement. Caseback serial number 682812. Good overall working condition with wear. Not tested for accuracy. May require routine cleaning or service. Weighs 47.8 grams. Hill Auction Gallery in house USA continental shipping $65 plus insurance. Gallery will refer local third party USA and international shippers. Purchaser pick up available upon request.

[MILGAUSS88]

The Hausmann print is in black, and could have been easily applied on the dial at any time. And it does not look very well done.

So the buyer wanted the case to replace his slightly over polished case. And he replaced the dial? Was the Hausmann dial repaired? Hill Gallery may not have noticed.

This would give him a "minty" Patek with "matching numbers".

I have never looked, on a Patek. But often time on pocket watches they stamp the serial number on the case, the back and the bezel. Does Patek do this as well?

[rootbeer7]

The caseback has certainly been opened at a minimum as its sitting in a different place in the pictures, compared with hallmark on the case. What an interesting bit of detective work. Perhaps someone didn’t care for someone else’s inscription and swapped it. I looked at vintage Rolex recently but couldn’t wear it with someone’s name engraved. I also didn’t want to buy it and swap it out. Subscribed!

[stabilizer81]

https://www.patekmonger.com/collecti...oma-circa-1956

[MILGAUSS88]

Listing confirms what was speculated.
Case or movement has been swapped out, and now there are 2 incorrect watches floating around that did not have to be that way.

[jfriedkin]

Nice find! The Fred Rettenmeyer Patek resurfaces for a 4th time. Now confirmed the the case and dial have been changed. Who ever did this actually destroyed TWO very rare PP 2526. Both the Fred Rettenmeyer and the "donor" watch have mismatched case and movement numbers.

Thanks for helping solve 'The Curious case of the Fred Rettenmeyer Patek'

[newonos]

its up for sale again. 1st Dibs: https://www.1stdibs.com/jewelry/watc...oPPQ&gclsrc=ds